Difference between revisions of "Alan Kay Presentation at HP Tech Con (2003)"

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ladies and gentlemen please welcome dick
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Lampman senior vice president of
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research and directors of HP labs
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earning I hope you all had a great day
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yesterday for me it was pretty exciting
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to see the full power of HP's technology
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team all in one place something we
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haven't been able to do for a long time
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and as you heard yesterday something
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that we're gonna make a regular event so
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it's great day so I have the pleasure
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today of introducing Alan Kay
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you heard that very briefly yesterday
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but Alan's a difficult guy to introduce
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to be honest he's certainly well known
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for his ideas on personal computing the
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intimate laptop computer the now
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ubiquitous overlapping Windows interface
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which I hope I don't see running out
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there right now
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and and of course modern object-oriented
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programming as Shane master'd mentioned
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yesterday he is one of the founders it
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was one of the founders of Xerox PARC
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earlier he was a member of the
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University Utah
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ARPA team that developed the original 3d
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computer graphics he has a very eclectic
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background he was the chief scientist at
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Atari a fellow at Apple Computer
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then a VP of R&D at Walt Disney Company
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and we're delighted now that he is a
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senior fellow and a member of our
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technical staff at HP Labs at the same
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time he's continuing as the president
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and co-founder of viewpoint viewpoints
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Research Institute it is an institute
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that is dedicated to improving general
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education and also understanding complex
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systems and especially using new
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inventions in interactive constructive
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computing to do this Allen is and has
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always been a disruptive thinker and
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today we asked him to talk about
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creativity and the title of his talk is
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the difference in creativity between
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children and adults
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and when I heard the title I thought to
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00:02:16,650 --> 00:02:19,530
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myself I guess at the end of the talk
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I'll have to decide which group I'd
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rather be in so I'll leave that
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challenge to you too
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anyway with that I am pleased to
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introduce Alan Kay thank you thanks very
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much
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first I'd like to say it's just an
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absolute pleasure and a privilege to be
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part of hewlett-packard I've admired the
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company over the years almost came here
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in the early 80s after Xerox PARC and
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I'm really glad to be here now this
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particular title and and talk came out
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of a couple of remarks I made it the HP
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Berkeley citrus meeting where I was
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describing a one of those encounters
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with children that gives you a sense of
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the difference between the way adults
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and children look at the world and this
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happened in in Toronto I thought I'd
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give you a little sense of what that was
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was actually like so we're up in Toronto
 +
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it's an eighth grade classroom wonderful
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teacher and that day visiting was also a
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group of fifth graders who have been
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marked as learning disabled learning
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disabilities who had also been trying
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the sweet stuff and so the question I
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00:03:48,900 --> 00:03:54,870
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got asked by the by the eighth grade
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79
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00:03:51,750 --> 00:03:59,580
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teacher was he said well we've been
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80
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00:03:54,870 --> 00:04:00,990
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exploring random notion of randomness
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81
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and stuff and one of the ways we did
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82
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this was to make one of these little
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00:04:02,780 --> 00:04:09,170
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squeak cars kind of like this
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84
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00:04:13,620 --> 00:04:21,510
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so make a little little object here put
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85
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00:04:18,730 --> 00:04:21,510
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some tires on it
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86
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00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:31,060
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and when I get done I have a little
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87
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00:04:28,010 --> 00:04:34,580
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thing that's both a graphics object and
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88
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00:04:31,060 --> 00:04:37,370
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something that's programmable so I can
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89
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00:04:34,580 --> 00:04:43,120
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make it a little bit smaller here I can
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90
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call it a car I can look inside of it I
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00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,570
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can drag out some stuff to make a little
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script here
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93
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so if card forward by five car turn by
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00:04:50,090 --> 00:05:00,320
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five and if I just say do that over and
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95
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00:04:55,820 --> 00:05:02,300
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over again I get a little circle these
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things are sort of secretly logo turtles
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with costumes so I can put a pin down
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see the circle drawn and then the
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teacher said when we couldn't figure out
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100
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00:05:14,660 --> 00:05:25,190
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how to do is although we could change
 +
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101
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the color of the of the pan so for
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instance we could click on this and we
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can make the pen trails green here there
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wasn't seem to be a way of selecting
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colors using random and he had this
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notion and in fact it's true in the
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underlying language that one of the ways
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of thinking about color is a kind of a
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vector space of primaries and you should
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00:05:55,970 --> 00:05:59,090
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be able to assign random to each one of
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those and generate a lot of different
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colors and we've forgotten to put that
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in the kids system so when they did the
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the random stuff they did it like this
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they would get a random number tile and
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so that's random 180 so it's turning all
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over the place and this one I have
 +
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learned that I'd better turn it off
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before I toss in here so I'll change
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this random 180 to random 80 and started
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going again it
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it's what they wanted to do is to do
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this but to have different colors so I
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said okay here's here's one way to do it
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you can make little get little ellipses
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out and you can change their color and
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put them into a little holder and change
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the color like this let me make this a
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lighter gray here and we can put random
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on the what the cursor does and then we
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can pick the colors out while I was
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going through this a 10 year old from
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the learning-disabled class came up and
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said oh I know a much better way to do
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this and he said look you can just pull
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00:07:16,030 --> 00:07:24,130
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a copy of that palette right out of
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00:07:20,530 --> 00:07:28,150
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there like this and you can start
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00:07:24,130 --> 00:07:34,480
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stretching it in here so if I do
 +
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00:07:28,150 --> 00:07:37,960
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something like this he says I've got a
 +
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00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:42,280
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little thing of all the colors there and
 +
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141
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00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:45,910
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I can just copy this car here using the
 +
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00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:50,410
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green button and now I've got two cars
 +
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143
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00:07:45,910 --> 00:07:58,330
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and all I have to do is to take the
 +
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00:07:50,410 --> 00:07:59,830
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color that's under this car color under
 +
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145
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00:07:58,330 --> 00:08:04,390
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this car and see if you move this car
 +
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00:07:59,830 --> 00:08:07,990
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around that value changes and so if I
 +
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147
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00:08:04,390 --> 00:08:12,180
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just drop this into the script here like
 +
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148
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00:08:07,990 --> 00:08:12,180
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this and I make them both go
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00:08:13,630 --> 00:08:18,000
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and I looked at and I said holy shit
 +
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150
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00:08:19,860 --> 00:08:25,480
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it's kind of a perfect illustration of
 +
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151
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00:08:22,740 --> 00:08:27,940
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the teacher only wanted to do it one way
 +
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00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:32,289
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and that way wasn't available so he
 +
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00:08:27,940 --> 00:08:35,500
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couldn't do it so I reverted back to my
 +
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pre object data structure common-sense
 +
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way and made a little data structure
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that doesn't do the full job whereas the
 +
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kid just took the system directly and
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the irony of the thing to me was that I
 +
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159
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00:08:49,420 --> 00:08:54,580
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had actually made everything in this
 +
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160
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00:08:52,690 --> 00:08:57,700
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system D constructible so the kid could
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 +
00:08:54,580 --> 00:08:59,770
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take it apart but I'd forgotten because
 +
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this this color palette that I got from
 +
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here looked like a thing to me and I
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forgot well of course it's it's just
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made out of parts here I can I can pull
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00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:13,690
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out anything that I want but the kid
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00:09:10,660 --> 00:09:16,090
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just went took it as it came went with
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what it could do and immediately saw
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00:09:16,090 --> 00:09:22,540
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that the problem was actually the same
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in both things that this car was walking
 +
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00:09:22,540 --> 00:09:26,440
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randomly around all you needed to do is
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 +
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have a copy of that car walking handling
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me around over here on top of the colors
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and you're done so that's the difference
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175
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 +
between children and adults is that we
 +
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 +
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 +
tend to think in patterns even when we
 +
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177
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 +
were trying not to and the kids don't
 +
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178
 +
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 +
have that many patterns yet and so
 +
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179
 +
00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:48,400
 +
they're much more able to deal with with
 +
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180
 +
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 +
the world that's put in front of them so
 +
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181
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 +
here's another example of a beautiful
 +
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 +
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 +
little solution completely solved by
 +
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183
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 +
children these two girls the class was
 +
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184
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 +
given the the challenge to figure out a
 +
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185
 +
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 +
robot car that could go down the center
 +
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186
 +
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 +
of the road and so they decided to make
 +
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187
 +
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 +
a road that was blue and it had curbs
 +
 +
188
 +
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 +
that were yellow and green and after
 +
 +
189
 +
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 +
much talking amongst themselves they
 +
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190
 +
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 +
decided it was actually a very simple
 +
 +
191
 +
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 +
problem only make the car go forward
 +
 +
192
 +
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 +
when you see the middle of the road the
 +
 +
193
 +
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 +
sensor on the car
 +
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194
 +
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 +
turn one way when you see a curb and
 +
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195
 +
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 +
turn the other way so to them goes just
 +
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196
 +
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 +
three cases and if you notice the car
 +
 +
197
 +
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 +
will actually stop and turn when it
 +
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198
 +
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 +
comes to a particularly sharp turn there
 +
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199
 +
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 +
and when questioned the girl said and of
 +
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200
 +
00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,829
 +
course it will work even if we don't
 +
 +
201
 +
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 +
draw the road very well because the plus
 +
 +
202
 +
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 +
four and the minus four cancel out so
 +
 +
203
 +
00:10:46,649 --> 00:10:51,000
 +
that these things are just can run
 +
 +
204
 +
00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:53,100
 +
separately and this car will always stay
 +
 +
205
 +
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 +
on the road and will stop as soon as it
 +
 +
206
 +
00:10:53,100 --> 00:10:59,880
 +
gets off the road like there there's
 +
 +
207
 +
00:10:57,300 --> 00:11:04,050
 +
another example of the kinds of things
 +
 +
208
 +
00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:06,060
 +
that children can do and in fact in many
 +
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209
 +
00:11:04,050 --> 00:11:11,579
 +
different ways
 +
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210
 +
00:11:06,060 --> 00:11:15,480
 +
six-year-olds have the most ability in
 +
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211
 +
00:11:11,579 --> 00:11:17,940
 +
many many different areas sometimes even
 +
 +
212
 +
00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:23,310
 +
in absolute terms here's a quick example
 +
 +
213
 +
00:11:17,940 --> 00:11:26,250
 +
of first graders with a teacher who not
 +
 +
214
 +
00:11:23,310 --> 00:11:27,990
 +
only loved children but also was kind of
 +
 +
215
 +
00:11:26,250 --> 00:11:30,870
 +
an intuitive mathematician so this is
 +
 +
216
 +
00:11:27,990 --> 00:11:32,279
 +
one of the few instances ever in the
 +
 +
217
 +
00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:35,160
 +
last 30 years of working with children
 +
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218
 +
00:11:32,279 --> 00:11:37,199
 +
we're going to an elementary school and
 +
 +
219
 +
00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:40,050
 +
find a teacher who actually has a real
 +
 +
220
 +
00:11:37,199 --> 00:11:41,820
 +
sense of mathematics this is about four
 +
 +
221
 +
00:11:40,050 --> 00:11:45,120
 +
months into their first grade she has
 +
 +
222
 +
00:11:41,820 --> 00:11:49,740
 +
them take different shaped blocks and to
 +
 +
223
 +
00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:52,709
 +
make entities of the same shape each
 +
 +
224
 +
00:11:49,740 --> 00:11:55,860
 +
size larger so here's the one with
 +
 +
225
 +
00:11:52,709 --> 00:11:58,170
 +
Diamonds trapezoids are quite a
 +
 +
226
 +
00:11:55,860 --> 00:12:00,959
 +
challenge so you have to turn them
 +
 +
227
 +
00:11:58,170 --> 00:12:05,630
 +
around and then what she did was to have
 +
 +
228
 +
00:12:00,959 --> 00:12:08,730
 +
the children write down off separately
 +
 +
229
 +
00:12:05,630 --> 00:12:11,130
 +
what it is they did by making a little
 +
 +
230
 +
00:12:08,730 --> 00:12:13,199
 +
construction project out of cardboard
 +
 +
231
 +
00:12:11,130 --> 00:12:16,980
 +
and then writing down a table so this
 +
 +
232
 +
00:12:13,199 --> 00:12:19,319
 +
child Lauren said well the first one had
 +
 +
233
 +
00:12:16,980 --> 00:12:21,569
 +
one block in it and then I have to add
 +
 +
234
 +
00:12:19,319 --> 00:12:23,519
 +
three more and it had four total blocks
 +
 +
235
 +
00:12:21,569 --> 00:12:25,949
 +
and then I had to add five and it had
 +
 +
236
 +
00:12:23,519 --> 00:12:28,260
 +
nine total and I had to add seven so
 +
 +
237
 +
00:12:25,949 --> 00:12:30,300
 +
they wrote these things down and they
 +
 +
238
 +
00:12:28,260 --> 00:12:34,170
 +
could see that this one differs just by
 +
 +
239
 +
00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:37,800
 +
two here all the way along
 +
 +
240
 +
00:12:34,170 --> 00:12:38,970
 +
and then they compared them and they
 +
 +
241
 +
00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:41,370
 +
discovered something really wonderful
 +
 +
242
 +
00:12:38,970 --> 00:12:45,209
 +
and that is that every single growth
 +
 +
243
 +
00:12:41,370 --> 00:12:46,890
 +
rule was exactly the same and this is a
 +
 +
244
 +
00:12:45,209 --> 00:12:49,440
 +
great crowd to show this example too
 +
 +
245
 +
00:12:46,890 --> 00:12:51,930
 +
because of surely you recognize the
 +
 +
246
 +
00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:54,930
 +
second-order differential equation or if
 +
 +
247
 +
00:12:51,930 --> 00:12:57,750
 +
you're an old old computer jock like me
 +
 +
248
 +
00:12:54,930 --> 00:13:00,000
 +
it's a two-stage digital differential
 +
 +
249
 +
00:12:57,750 --> 00:13:02,579
 +
analyzer this is the kind of thing that
 +
 +
250
 +
00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:06,149
 +
Babbage made the difference engine to
 +
 +
251
 +
00:13:02,579 --> 00:13:09,000
 +
compute that computes all the squares of
 +
 +
252
 +
00:13:06,149 --> 00:13:12,149
 +
the numbers driven by this constant
 +
 +
253
 +
00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:16,170
 +
difference of two here also a model of
 +
 +
254
 +
00:13:12,149 --> 00:13:18,450
 +
acceleration and this is also an example
 +
 +
255
 +
00:13:16,170 --> 00:13:20,540
 +
of the kind of things that children can
 +
 +
256
 +
00:13:18,450 --> 00:13:23,399
 +
generate and the way they form
 +
 +
257
 +
00:13:20,540 --> 00:13:26,760
 +
abstractions which is not by bundling
 +
 +
258
 +
00:13:23,399 --> 00:13:29,190
 +
them up the way we do into a term but by
 +
 +
259
 +
00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:38,550
 +
thinking of them as a bunch of cases
 +
 +
260
 +
00:13:29,190 --> 00:13:40,529
 +
that go together now what happens to us
 +
 +
261
 +
00:13:38,550 --> 00:13:44,310
 +
as we get older as we start forming this
 +
 +
262
 +
00:13:40,529 --> 00:13:47,040
 +
goldfish bowl made out of an invisible
 +
 +
263
 +
00:13:44,310 --> 00:13:48,209
 +
fluid that we can't see anymore so
 +
 +
264
 +
00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,670
 +
McLuhan statement I don't know who
 +
 +
265
 +
00:13:48,209 --> 00:13:53,730
 +
discovered water but it wasn't a fish he
 +
 +
266
 +
00:13:50,670 --> 00:13:57,630
 +
really meant we were the fish and this
 +
 +
267
 +
00:13:53,730 --> 00:14:00,029
 +
pink fluid in here is all the things
 +
 +
268
 +
00:13:57,630 --> 00:14:01,380
 +
that we've internalized to the point
 +
 +
269
 +
00:14:00,029 --> 00:14:03,600
 +
that we can't remember that we did it
 +
 +
270
 +
00:14:01,380 --> 00:14:05,399
 +
anymore and these are these invisible
 +
 +
271
 +
00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:08,120
 +
things are the things that rule our
 +
 +
272
 +
00:14:05,399 --> 00:14:12,209
 +
lives much more than almost anything and
 +
 +
273
 +
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:16,170
 +
kids learn this very early so up to
 +
 +
274
 +
00:14:12,209 --> 00:14:19,170
 +
around the age of seven children are at
 +
 +
275
 +
00:14:16,170 --> 00:14:21,959
 +
their best and after most imaginative
 +
 +
276
 +
00:14:19,170 --> 00:14:23,670
 +
with featureless blocks blocks that have
 +
 +
277
 +
00:14:21,959 --> 00:14:28,730
 +
nothing on them and you could take a
 +
 +
278
 +
00:14:23,670 --> 00:14:30,959
 +
little square block oblong block and
 +
 +
279
 +
00:14:28,730 --> 00:14:32,310
 +
suggest to the child boy this looks like
 +
 +
280
 +
00:14:30,959 --> 00:14:34,740
 +
a really wonderful truck and they'll
 +
 +
281
 +
00:14:32,310 --> 00:14:38,610
 +
play with it as a truck and then you can
 +
 +
282
 +
00:14:34,740 --> 00:14:42,240
 +
say no it also looks kind of like like a
 +
 +
283
 +
00:14:38,610 --> 00:14:44,880
 +
little baby and they'll look at it and
 +
 +
284
 +
00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,810
 +
start cradling it because they're
 +
 +
285
 +
00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:49,540
 +
basically their powers of imagine
 +
 +
286
 +
00:14:46,810 --> 00:14:55,120
 +
Asian are able to be projected on the
 +
 +
287
 +
00:14:49,540 --> 00:14:56,560
 +
world around them and then by around the
 +
 +
288
 +
00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:58,180
 +
age of seven and actually it's going
 +
 +
289
 +
00:14:56,560 --> 00:15:01,930
 +
earlier people who've been studying this
 +
 +
290
 +
00:14:58,180 --> 00:15:06,490
 +
see a huge influence of television but
 +
 +
291
 +
00:15:01,930 --> 00:15:11,080
 +
it's also partly biological to go away
 +
 +
292
 +
00:15:06,490 --> 00:15:13,690
 +
from that kind of external imposition of
 +
 +
293
 +
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:16,930
 +
imagination which characterizes the
 +
 +
294
 +
00:15:13,690 --> 00:15:19,450
 +
young child to taking in images and
 +
 +
295
 +
00:15:16,930 --> 00:15:23,740
 +
forms from the outside and conventional
 +
 +
296
 +
00:15:19,450 --> 00:15:27,310
 +
izing them till they start wanting much
 +
 +
297
 +
00:15:23,740 --> 00:15:31,240
 +
much more detail in their toys in
 +
 +
298
 +
00:15:27,310 --> 00:15:35,290
 +
various various ways and they give you
 +
 +
299
 +
00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:46,120
 +
an example of how strong this is this is
 +
 +
300
 +
00:15:35,290 --> 00:15:48,790
 +
a famous video done it NSF that went
 +
 +
301
 +
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:51,490
 +
went to a Harvard graduation right after
 +
 +
302
 +
00:15:48,790 --> 00:15:53,410
 +
the seniors toss their tassels and ask
 +
 +
303
 +
00:15:51,490 --> 00:15:55,839
 +
them a couple of simple questions about
 +
 +
304
 +
00:15:53,410 --> 00:15:57,850
 +
the seasons and about the phases of the
 +
 +
305
 +
00:15:55,839 --> 00:16:00,400
 +
Moon so you can see what the Harvard
 +
 +
306
 +
00:15:57,850 --> 00:16:02,170
 +
graduates think about this to test how a
 +
 +
307
 +
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:04,120
 +
lifetime of Education affects our
 +
 +
308
 +
00:16:02,170 --> 00:16:05,650
 +
understanding of science we ask these
 +
 +
309
 +
00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:09,010
 +
recent graduates some simple questions
 +
 +
310
 +
00:16:05,650 --> 00:16:10,780
 +
in astronomy consider for example that
 +
 +
311
 +
00:16:09,010 --> 00:16:12,820
 +
the causes of the seasons is a topic
 +
 +
312
 +
00:16:10,780 --> 00:16:15,070
 +
taught in every standard curriculum ok I
 +
 +
313
 +
00:16:12,820 --> 00:16:17,410
 +
think the seasons happens because as the
 +
 +
314
 +
00:16:15,070 --> 00:16:21,040
 +
earth travels around the Sun it gets
 +
 +
315
 +
00:16:17,410 --> 00:16:22,420
 +
nearer to the Sun which produces warmer
 +
 +
316
 +
00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,760
 +
weather and gets farther away which
 +
 +
317
 +
00:16:22,420 --> 00:16:26,680
 +
produces colder weather and then hence
 +
 +
318
 +
00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:28,330
 +
the seasons how hot it is or how cold it
 +
 +
319
 +
00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:31,240
 +
is in any given time of the year has to
 +
 +
320
 +
00:16:28,330 --> 00:16:33,699
 +
do with the the closeness of the earth
 +
 +
321
 +
00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:38,079
 +
to the Sun during the seasonal
 +
 +
322
 +
00:16:33,699 --> 00:16:39,309
 +
the earth goes around the Sun and and it
 +
 +
323
 +
00:16:38,079 --> 00:16:40,419
 +
gets hotter when we get closer to the
 +
 +
324
 +
00:16:39,309 --> 00:16:41,769
 +
Sun and it gets colder when we get
 +
 +
325
 +
00:16:40,419 --> 00:16:44,290
 +
further away from the Sun these
 +
 +
326
 +
00:16:41,769 --> 00:16:46,119
 +
graduates like many of us think of the
 +
 +
327
 +
00:16:44,290 --> 00:16:48,730
 +
Earth's orbit as a highly exaggerated
 +
 +
328
 +
00:16:46,119 --> 00:16:51,339
 +
ellipse even though the Earth's orbit is
 +
 +
329
 +
00:16:48,730 --> 00:16:53,049
 +
very nearly circular with distance
 +
 +
330
 +
00:16:51,339 --> 00:16:55,839
 +
producing virtually no effect on the
 +
 +
331
 +
00:16:53,049 --> 00:16:58,749
 +
seasons we carry with us the strong
 +
 +
332
 +
00:16:55,839 --> 00:17:01,419
 +
incorrect belief that changing distance
 +
 +
333
 +
00:16:58,749 --> 00:17:04,049
 +
is responsible for the seasons I took
 +
 +
334
 +
00:17:01,419 --> 00:17:08,980
 +
physics and planetary motion and
 +
 +
335
 +
00:17:04,049 --> 00:17:10,720
 +
relativity I've never really had a
 +
 +
336
 +
00:17:08,980 --> 00:17:12,159
 +
scientific background whatsoever and I
 +
 +
337
 +
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:13,990
 +
and I got through school without having
 +
 +
338
 +
00:17:12,159 --> 00:17:16,959
 +
it I've gotten very far without having
 +
 +
339
 +
00:17:13,990 --> 00:17:20,649
 +
it I had quite a bit of science in high
 +
 +
340
 +
00:17:16,959 --> 00:17:22,529
 +
school yeah through physics want first
 +
 +
341
 +
00:17:20,649 --> 00:17:26,169
 +
year in two years of chemistry
 +
 +
342
 +
00:17:22,529 --> 00:17:28,690
 +
regardless of their science education 21
 +
 +
343
 +
00:17:26,169 --> 00:17:30,840
 +
of the 23 randomly selected students
 +
 +
344
 +
00:17:28,690 --> 00:17:33,639
 +
faculty and alumni of Harvard University
 +
 +
345
 +
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:36,250
 +
revealed misconceptions when asked to
 +
 +
346
 +
00:17:33,639 --> 00:17:38,070
 +
explain either the seasons or the phases
 +
 +
347
 +
00:17:36,250 --> 00:17:42,240
 +
of the Moon when it's further away from
 +
 +
348
 +
00:17:38,070 --> 00:17:45,309
 +
the Sun then it gets colder the earth
 +
 +
349
 +
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:51,850
 +
position interferes with the reflection
 +
 +
350
 +
00:17:45,309 --> 00:17:53,860
 +
of the Sun against the moon so I think
 +
 +
351
 +
00:17:51,850 --> 00:17:55,990
 +
you can see that the main curriculum at
 +
 +
352
 +
00:17:53,860 --> 00:17:59,990
 +
Harvard is confidence 101
 +
 +
353
 +
00:17:55,990 --> 00:17:59,990
 +
[Laughter]
 +
 +
354
 +
00:18:00,220 --> 00:18:06,559
 +
and if you if you know about what the
 +
 +
355
 +
00:18:04,730 --> 00:18:08,390
 +
color of the Harvard ph.d robe is you
 +
 +
356
 +
00:18:06,559 --> 00:18:13,130
 +
can see whether this Harvard professor
 +
 +
357
 +
00:18:08,390 --> 00:18:15,620
 +
got his ph.d so I kept on waiting on
 +
 +
358
 +
00:18:13,130 --> 00:18:18,590
 +
this video for NSF to ask the most
 +
 +
359
 +
00:18:15,620 --> 00:18:20,809
 +
logical next questions but they never
 +
 +
360
 +
00:18:18,590 --> 00:18:22,549
 +
did they had a different idea of what to
 +
 +
361
 +
00:18:20,809 --> 00:18:26,690
 +
do with the video so a couple of weeks
 +
 +
362
 +
00:18:22,549 --> 00:18:30,730
 +
later I and was giving a class at talk
 +
 +
363
 +
00:18:26,690 --> 00:18:33,350
 +
at UCLA and the audience were mostly
 +
 +
364
 +
00:18:30,730 --> 00:18:35,029
 +
graduating seniors and I asked a bunch
 +
 +
365
 +
00:18:33,350 --> 00:18:37,070
 +
of them to come out on the law and after
 +
 +
366
 +
00:18:35,029 --> 00:18:40,010
 +
the talk and went through exactly the
 +
 +
367
 +
00:18:37,070 --> 00:18:44,299
 +
same questions and I got roughly the
 +
 +
368
 +
00:18:40,010 --> 00:18:47,059
 +
same result about 95% of these UCLA
 +
 +
369
 +
00:18:44,299 --> 00:18:48,970
 +
graduate graduating seniors had serious
 +
 +
370
 +
00:18:47,059 --> 00:18:51,860
 +
misconceptions about one or both of
 +
 +
371
 +
00:18:48,970 --> 00:18:56,779
 +
these ideas but then I got to ask the
 +
 +
372
 +
00:18:51,860 --> 00:18:58,610
 +
obvious next question so to the ones who
 +
 +
373
 +
00:18:56,779 --> 00:19:00,740
 +
thought proximity of the earth to the
 +
 +
374
 +
00:18:58,610 --> 00:19:03,500
 +
Sun had something to do with the seasons
 +
 +
375
 +
00:19:00,740 --> 00:19:04,520
 +
I said well tell me this when it's
 +
 +
376
 +
00:19:03,500 --> 00:19:06,679
 +
summer up here in the northern
 +
 +
377
 +
00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:12,169
 +
hemisphere do you know what season it is
 +
 +
378
 +
00:19:06,679 --> 00:19:14,570
 +
in the southern hemisphere and every
 +
 +
379
 +
00:19:12,169 --> 00:19:19,549
 +
single one of them did of course they
 +
 +
380
 +
00:19:14,570 --> 00:19:21,380
 +
didn't know why but what was interesting
 +
 +
381
 +
00:19:19,549 --> 00:19:25,700
 +
that there was about a thirty after they
 +
 +
382
 +
00:19:21,380 --> 00:19:27,740
 +
had said well it's winter then there's a
 +
 +
383
 +
00:19:25,700 --> 00:19:29,230
 +
30-second pause while I slowly realized
 +
 +
384
 +
00:19:27,740 --> 00:19:31,610
 +
that what they had just said
 +
 +
385
 +
00:19:29,230 --> 00:19:33,679
 +
contradicted their proximity theory and
 +
 +
386
 +
00:19:31,610 --> 00:19:39,679
 +
it's very important to realize here
 +
 +
387
 +
00:19:33,679 --> 00:19:42,140
 +
cognitively that those two ideas were
 +
 +
388
 +
00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:45,289
 +
indexed by the same terms they both had
 +
 +
389
 +
00:19:42,140 --> 00:19:48,020
 +
seasons in them and yet what happened
 +
 +
390
 +
00:19:45,289 --> 00:19:50,870
 +
was that the students could not retrieve
 +
 +
391
 +
00:19:48,020 --> 00:19:53,270
 +
anything that they knew as part of their
 +
 +
392
 +
00:19:50,870 --> 00:19:56,000
 +
thinking process so they just fell back
 +
 +
393
 +
00:19:53,270 --> 00:19:57,289
 +
on their common sense and it's warmer
 +
 +
394
 +
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,659
 +
when you're nearer the stove and so
 +
 +
395
 +
00:19:57,289 --> 00:20:01,340
 +
forth and for the students who are like
 +
 +
396
 +
00:19:59,659 --> 00:20:03,380
 +
this guy who thought that the earth had
 +
 +
397
 +
00:20:01,340 --> 00:20:05,470
 +
something to do with the phases of the
 +
 +
398
 +
00:20:03,380 --> 00:20:07,789
 +
Moon I asked them have you ever seen the
 +
 +
399
 +
00:20:05,470 --> 00:20:10,880
 +
Sun and the moon in the sky at the same
 +
 +
400
 +
00:20:07,789 --> 00:20:11,410
 +
time and they all had and I said well is
 +
 +
401
 +
00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,350
 +
the
 +
 +
402
 +
00:20:11,410 --> 00:20:16,870
 +
moon sometimes in phase and yeah it's
 +
 +
403
 +
00:20:14,350 --> 00:20:19,059
 +
often in phase unless they're the
 +
 +
404
 +
00:20:16,870 --> 00:20:20,980
 +
opposite ends of the horizon the moon is
 +
 +
405
 +
00:20:19,059 --> 00:20:22,929
 +
always in phase and then again a
 +
 +
406
 +
00:20:20,980 --> 00:20:25,390
 +
30-second pause while I realize there is
 +
 +
407
 +
00:20:22,929 --> 00:20:26,830
 +
no pseudopod sticking out from the earth
 +
 +
408
 +
00:20:25,390 --> 00:20:29,290
 +
you know they could see both of them up
 +
 +
409
 +
00:20:26,830 --> 00:20:31,900
 +
there so this is something they'd seen
 +
 +
410
 +
00:20:29,290 --> 00:20:33,640
 +
dozens and dozens of times but it was
 +
 +
411
 +
00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:35,230
 +
again stored in another little
 +
 +
412
 +
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:38,020
 +
compartment that you could illicit it
 +
 +
413
 +
00:20:35,230 --> 00:20:41,350
 +
through questioning but it wasn't part
 +
 +
414
 +
00:20:38,020 --> 00:20:45,030
 +
of their thinking process so this what
 +
 +
415
 +
00:20:41,350 --> 00:20:48,850
 +
we're seeing here is actually a normal
 +
 +
416
 +
00:20:45,030 --> 00:20:50,890
 +
completely normal kind of behavior and
 +
 +
417
 +
00:20:48,850 --> 00:20:52,330
 +
it's funny because technical and
 +
 +
418
 +
00:20:50,890 --> 00:20:53,530
 +
scientific people always laugh when they
 +
 +
419
 +
00:20:52,330 --> 00:20:55,240
 +
see the students doing that but what
 +
 +
420
 +
00:20:53,530 --> 00:20:57,240
 +
they don't realize is that they do it
 +
 +
421
 +
00:20:55,240 --> 00:21:00,520
 +
themselves in a different area
 +
 +
422
 +
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:02,650
 +
because this is one of the key notes the
 +
 +
423
 +
00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:08,530
 +
keys to think thinking about human
 +
 +
424
 +
00:21:02,650 --> 00:21:10,600
 +
thinking Mircea Eliade is basically a
 +
 +
425
 +
00:21:08,530 --> 00:21:12,549
 +
mat an anthropologist who's interested
 +
 +
426
 +
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:15,720
 +
in belief systems it's written many
 +
 +
427
 +
00:21:12,549 --> 00:21:18,820
 +
interesting books as a particularly
 +
 +
428
 +
00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:22,419
 +
interesting anecdote in this book called
 +
 +
429
 +
00:21:18,820 --> 00:21:25,200
 +
the myth of the eternal return and this
 +
 +
430
 +
00:21:22,419 --> 00:21:27,460
 +
was in the 30s he and a bunch of other
 +
 +
431
 +
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,890
 +
anthropologists were going through
 +
 +
432
 +
00:21:27,460 --> 00:21:34,780
 +
Eastern Europe writing down and
 +
 +
433
 +
00:21:29,890 --> 00:21:36,490
 +
recording folk songs and stories and so
 +
 +
434
 +
00:21:34,780 --> 00:21:39,070
 +
forth and they came to a village that
 +
 +
435
 +
00:21:36,490 --> 00:21:42,790
 +
had a particularly beautiful song about
 +
 +
436
 +
00:21:39,070 --> 00:21:44,290
 +
a young bride and a handsome groom who
 +
 +
437
 +
00:21:42,790 --> 00:21:47,770
 +
are on their way to their wedding and
 +
 +
438
 +
00:21:44,290 --> 00:21:51,429
 +
the fairies swooped down jealously and
 +
 +
439
 +
00:21:47,770 --> 00:21:54,640
 +
took the groom away and the wedding
 +
 +
440
 +
00:21:51,429 --> 00:21:56,140
 +
never happened and it was such a
 +
 +
441
 +
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,200
 +
beautiful song that they questioned the
 +
 +
442
 +
00:21:56,140 --> 00:22:01,690
 +
villagers more about it and they said
 +
 +
443
 +
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:04,360
 +
well how long ago did it happen Oh a
 +
 +
444
 +
00:22:01,690 --> 00:22:08,830
 +
long time ago well how long it going
 +
 +
445
 +
00:22:04,360 --> 00:22:10,299
 +
they said Oh about 50 years ago and they
 +
 +
446
 +
00:22:08,830 --> 00:22:15,130
 +
questioned them more and discovered that
 +
 +
447
 +
00:22:10,299 --> 00:22:17,590
 +
the bride-to-be was still living so they
 +
 +
448
 +
00:22:15,130 --> 00:22:22,450
 +
went to talk to her she said no no that
 +
 +
449
 +
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:24,700
 +
song we were walking along the side of a
 +
 +
450
 +
00:22:22,450 --> 00:22:26,080
 +
hill and he tripped on a root
 +
 +
451
 +
00:22:24,700 --> 00:22:29,200
 +
fell down the hill and broke his neck
 +
 +
452
 +
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:31,800
 +
and you know it was very sad but that's
 +
 +
453
 +
00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:33,880
 +
what happened so they went back to the
 +
 +
454
 +
00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:36,190
 +
villagers and said well she said he
 +
 +
455
 +
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:41,850
 +
tripped on a root and they said no no
 +
 +
456
 +
00:22:36,190 --> 00:22:45,040
 +
the fairies came down and so basically
 +
 +
457
 +
00:22:41,850 --> 00:22:47,260
 +
almost everything we know and think
 +
 +
458
 +
00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:51,010
 +
about even when we're trying to do
 +
 +
459
 +
00:22:47,260 --> 00:22:52,720
 +
better are in the form of stories the
 +
 +
460
 +
00:22:51,010 --> 00:22:55,210
 +
stories are usually better than what
 +
 +
461
 +
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:58,960
 +
happened in the sense of their tidiness
 +
 +
462
 +
00:22:55,210 --> 00:23:00,760
 +
the stories are hermetic so if you see a
 +
 +
463
 +
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:03,310
 +
movie that you like last week that's
 +
 +
464
 +
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:05,440
 +
very very different and even
 +
 +
465
 +
00:23:03,310 --> 00:23:07,570
 +
contradictory to the movie you saw today
 +
 +
466
 +
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:09,490
 +
and liked there's no feeling of
 +
 +
467
 +
00:23:07,570 --> 00:23:11,650
 +
dissonance at all because it's the
 +
 +
468
 +
00:23:09,490 --> 00:23:16,300
 +
purpose of these stories to be
 +
 +
469
 +
00:23:11,650 --> 00:23:19,840
 +
compartmentalized and hole in themselves
 +
 +
470
 +
00:23:16,300 --> 00:23:24,780
 +
and so we have this compartmentalization
 +
 +
471
 +
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:28,570
 +
system that is also very very case based
 +
 +
472
 +
00:23:24,780 --> 00:23:31,360
 +
so nothing resembling what we would call
 +
 +
473
 +
00:23:28,570 --> 00:23:35,080
 +
modern thinking is actually built into
 +
 +
474
 +
00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:39,040
 +
our nervous systems so one way of
 +
 +
475
 +
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:40,780
 +
thinking about this stuff is if we take
 +
 +
476
 +
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:43,330
 +
the pink stuff in the goldfish bowl and
 +
 +
477
 +
00:23:40,780 --> 00:23:44,920
 +
flatten it out we have Arthur kessler's
 +
 +
478
 +
00:23:43,330 --> 00:23:48,460
 +
model of thinking which is kind of an
 +
 +
479
 +
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:50,140
 +
ant crawling along a plane and again
 +
 +
480
 +
00:23:48,460 --> 00:23:52,750
 +
it's blissfully unaware that the plane
 +
 +
481
 +
00:23:50,140 --> 00:23:56,620
 +
is pink and the ant can have the
 +
 +
482
 +
00:23:52,750 --> 00:23:58,780
 +
illusion of progress so I can point
 +
 +
483
 +
00:23:56,620 --> 00:24:02,350
 +
itself at a goal and try to get to it
 +
 +
484
 +
00:23:58,780 --> 00:24:03,970
 +
and it can problem solve and get around
 +
 +
485
 +
00:24:02,350 --> 00:24:10,180
 +
the goal but everything that's doing is
 +
 +
486
 +
00:24:03,970 --> 00:24:13,240
 +
is actually pink but if you ant like us
 +
 +
487
 +
00:24:10,180 --> 00:24:16,000
 +
maybe taking a shower out for a run
 +
 +
488
 +
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:17,680
 +
getting up in the morning a little
 +
 +
489
 +
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:22,080
 +
unguarded thing a little blue thought
 +
 +
490
 +
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:22,080
 +
might poke up but
 +
 +
491
 +
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:30,860
 +
we've spent years with our parents
 +
 +
492
 +
00:24:26,020 --> 00:24:35,750
 +
school our culture going to church of
 +
 +
493
 +
00:24:30,860 --> 00:24:37,970
 +
various kinds learning the pink and it's
 +
 +
494
 +
00:24:35,750 --> 00:24:40,580
 +
good reason for it this is one of these
 +
 +
495
 +
00:24:37,970 --> 00:24:42,140
 +
cases where the first order theory is a
 +
 +
496
 +
00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:43,700
 +
good one and it's opposite from the
 +
 +
497
 +
00:24:42,140 --> 00:24:44,030
 +
second order theory which is also a good
 +
 +
498
 +
00:24:43,700 --> 00:24:45,590
 +
one
 +
 +
499
 +
00:24:44,030 --> 00:24:49,010
 +
first order theory is if you're a
 +
 +
500
 +
00:24:45,590 --> 00:24:51,890
 +
subsistence Society don't try to make
 +
 +
501
 +
00:24:49,010 --> 00:24:56,060
 +
too many experiments you can't afford to
 +
 +
502
 +
00:24:51,890 --> 00:24:58,640
 +
lose and so our basic approach to things
 +
 +
503
 +
00:24:56,060 --> 00:25:03,800
 +
is to be relatively conservative and to
 +
 +
504
 +
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:05,980
 +
improve slowly on the fringes but every
 +
 +
505
 +
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:10,220
 +
once in a while in spite of all of this
 +
 +
506
 +
00:25:05,980 --> 00:25:13,150
 +
you get a full-fledged blue idea it's an
 +
 +
507
 +
00:25:10,220 --> 00:25:15,590
 +
outlaw idea it's outside the confines of
 +
 +
508
 +
00:25:13,150 --> 00:25:17,300
 +
common sense and so how many people here
 +
 +
509
 +
00:25:15,590 --> 00:25:21,740
 +
have had one of those ideas betcha
 +
 +
510
 +
00:25:17,300 --> 00:25:23,300
 +
everybody has had a weird idea now the
 +
 +
511
 +
00:25:21,740 --> 00:25:25,490
 +
problem with these weird ideas like all
 +
 +
512
 +
00:25:23,300 --> 00:25:31,550
 +
ideas is almost all of them are mediocre
 +
 +
513
 +
00:25:25,490 --> 00:25:33,200
 +
down to bad even the blue ones now often
 +
 +
514
 +
00:25:31,550 --> 00:25:36,820
 +
when people had a blue idea in the past
 +
 +
515
 +
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,820
 +
they'd go out and start a religion
 +
 +
516
 +
00:25:37,870 --> 00:25:41,720
 +
because if you've had one of these blue
 +
 +
517
 +
00:25:40,010 --> 00:25:44,570
 +
ideas you know it seems to come from the
 +
 +
518
 +
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:46,130
 +
heavens you weren't really thinking
 +
 +
519
 +
00:25:44,570 --> 00:25:49,520
 +
about this and all of a sudden you have
 +
 +
520
 +
00:25:46,130 --> 00:25:50,990
 +
this weird thought so one of the most
 +
 +
521
 +
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,330
 +
important things that Benny Landa
 +
 +
522
 +
00:25:50,990 --> 00:25:54,800
 +
pointed out yesterday is you have to be
 +
 +
523
 +
00:25:53,330 --> 00:25:56,770
 +
very careful with these blue ideas
 +
 +
524
 +
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,820
 +
because they seem to be manifestly true
 +
 +
525
 +
00:25:56,770 --> 00:26:01,310
 +
and you have to make sure that the blue
 +
 +
526
 +
00:25:58,820 --> 00:26:05,300
 +
ideas above some special kind of
 +
 +
527
 +
00:26:01,310 --> 00:26:07,760
 +
threshold before because it's going to
 +
 +
528
 +
00:26:05,300 --> 00:26:09,050
 +
take a lot of work to first work it out
 +
 +
529
 +
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:11,450
 +
it's going to take a lot more work to
 +
 +
530
 +
00:26:09,050 --> 00:26:18,740
 +
convince anybody that's a reasonable
 +
 +
531
 +
00:26:11,450 --> 00:26:20,870
 +
idea and this is because for the really
 +
 +
532
 +
00:26:18,740 --> 00:26:25,240
 +
unusual ideas it takes almost as much
 +
 +
533
 +
00:26:20,870 --> 00:26:28,550
 +
creative effort to understand and learn
 +
 +
534
 +
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:30,500
 +
as it did to originally invent it and
 +
 +
535
 +
00:26:28,550 --> 00:26:33,230
 +
this is what what is tough because when
 +
 +
536
 +
00:26:30,500 --> 00:26:37,400
 +
we have one of these ideas we work it
 +
 +
537
 +
00:26:33,230 --> 00:26:41,060
 +
out and it works out beautifully at some
 +
 +
538
 +
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:42,620
 +
point we forget what happened before we
 +
 +
539
 +
00:26:41,060 --> 00:26:44,390
 +
have that idea what we were like because
 +
 +
540
 +
00:26:42,620 --> 00:26:47,930
 +
we're now a new kind of person because
 +
 +
541
 +
00:26:44,390 --> 00:26:50,870
 +
of this idea and we cannot believe that
 +
 +
542
 +
00:26:47,930 --> 00:26:52,880
 +
other people can't understand it because
 +
 +
543
 +
00:26:50,870 --> 00:26:58,810
 +
it's so manifestly true and here's the
 +
 +
544
 +
00:26:52,880 --> 00:27:02,570
 +
demo so how do we get in the way of this
 +
 +
545
 +
00:26:58,810 --> 00:27:04,540
 +
as I talked about two things already
 +
 +
546
 +
00:27:02,570 --> 00:27:07,490
 +
case based reasoning and
 +
 +
547
 +
00:27:04,540 --> 00:27:10,460
 +
compartmentalization and the third one
 +
 +
548
 +
00:27:07,490 --> 00:27:12,920
 +
which is very related to this is called
 +
 +
549
 +
00:27:10,460 --> 00:27:15,650
 +
instrumental reasoning built into all
 +
 +
550
 +
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:17,390
 +
human nervous systems is the tendency to
 +
 +
551
 +
00:27:15,650 --> 00:27:21,920
 +
get really interested in our current
 +
 +
552
 +
00:27:17,390 --> 00:27:24,680
 +
goals and to judge new ideas and new
 +
 +
553
 +
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:29,990
 +
tools solely by their ability to deal
 +
 +
554
 +
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:31,580
 +
with our current goals so there's a few
 +
 +
555
 +
00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:34,940
 +
percentage of people who are much better
 +
 +
556
 +
00:27:31,580 --> 00:27:37,940
 +
at transforming themselves in the
 +
 +
557
 +
00:27:34,940 --> 00:27:39,920
 +
presence of a new idea in the presence
 +
 +
558
 +
00:27:37,940 --> 00:27:42,170
 +
of a new tool they change themselves
 +
 +
559
 +
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:44,960
 +
they don't try and change the idea and
 +
 +
560
 +
00:27:42,170 --> 00:27:47,090
 +
the tool into them but this is very rare
 +
 +
561
 +
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:50,090
 +
and so one way of thinking about this is
 +
 +
562
 +
00:27:47,090 --> 00:27:53,600
 +
that instrumental reasoning prevents
 +
 +
563
 +
00:27:50,090 --> 00:27:55,580
 +
this little blue hop over the fence of
 +
 +
564
 +
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,610
 +
your goal structure even to a new pink
 +
 +
565
 +
00:27:55,580 --> 00:28:01,010
 +
idea something that's part of the
 +
 +
566
 +
00:27:58,610 --> 00:28:03,680
 +
conventional way of doing things but we
 +
 +
567
 +
00:28:01,010 --> 00:28:06,800
 +
can't get to it because we're focused on
 +
 +
568
 +
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:09,500
 +
this and this accounts in many many
 +
 +
569
 +
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:11,420
 +
parts for why the last the
 +
 +
570
 +
00:28:09,500 --> 00:28:15,650
 +
commercialization of the PC has been so
 +
 +
571
 +
00:28:11,420 --> 00:28:18,850
 +
boring exceptions are interesting but
 +
 +
572
 +
00:28:15,650 --> 00:28:21,380
 +
generally speaking most business people
 +
 +
573
 +
00:28:18,850 --> 00:28:25,220
 +
are very goal-oriented they're very
 +
 +
574
 +
00:28:21,380 --> 00:28:28,700
 +
instrumental they look at new ideas and
 +
 +
575
 +
00:28:25,220 --> 00:28:29,570
 +
new technology as and judge it as to
 +
 +
576
 +
00:28:28,700 --> 00:28:30,740
 +
whether it is
 +
 +
577
 +
00:28:29,570 --> 00:28:33,200
 +
similar to what they're doing but a
 +
 +
578
 +
00:28:30,740 --> 00:28:36,950
 +
little bit better and the people who
 +
 +
579
 +
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:40,160
 +
have had a exquisite rhythm we're just
 +
 +
580
 +
00:28:36,950 --> 00:28:42,800
 +
staying a couple of epsilon ahead of the
 +
 +
581
 +
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:45,050
 +
slow pace of business learning have been
 +
 +
582
 +
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:47,810
 +
tremendously successful people like
 +
 +
583
 +
00:28:45,050 --> 00:28:51,800
 +
Engelbart who actually understood in one
 +
 +
584
 +
00:28:47,810 --> 00:28:53,390
 +
fell swoop in the 60s one large part of
 +
 +
585
 +
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,310
 +
what computers were really good for and
 +
 +
586
 +
00:28:53,390 --> 00:28:57,410
 +
how they should be used by people who
 +
 +
587
 +
00:28:55,310 --> 00:29:00,680
 +
are working have not to this day been
 +
 +
588
 +
00:28:57,410 --> 00:29:03,320
 +
understood or adopted so that's a little
 +
 +
589
 +
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:08,350
 +
discouraging and in fact there's a few
 +
 +
590
 +
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:08,350
 +
more discouraging things to add here
 +
 +
591
 +
00:29:08,980 --> 00:29:15,620
 +
another one that we will recognize in
 +
 +
592
 +
00:29:11,930 --> 00:29:17,240
 +
our own technical lives as well as
 +
 +
593
 +
00:29:15,620 --> 00:29:21,440
 +
elsewhere as when the sub goals become
 +
 +
594
 +
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:23,510
 +
the goals so you usually start off doing
 +
 +
595
 +
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,760
 +
something that has a grand purpose and
 +
 +
596
 +
00:29:23,510 --> 00:29:27,800
 +
after two or three years of solving sub
 +
 +
597
 +
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:32,990
 +
goals you can't remember what the grand
 +
 +
598
 +
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:38,330
 +
purpose is anymore so originally trains
 +
 +
599
 +
00:29:32,990 --> 00:29:41,570
 +
railroads were set up to deal with Trant
 +
 +
600
 +
00:29:38,330 --> 00:29:45,230
 +
transportation but by the 30s the
 +
 +
601
 +
00:29:41,570 --> 00:29:47,030
 +
railroad companies only invested in
 +
 +
602
 +
00:29:45,230 --> 00:29:51,350
 +
improving railroads and they completely
 +
 +
603
 +
00:29:47,030 --> 00:29:53,180
 +
missed the idea of the other dimension
 +
 +
604
 +
00:29:51,350 --> 00:29:56,420
 +
this is code of a perfect analog to the
 +
 +
605
 +
00:29:53,180 --> 00:29:59,660
 +
pink plane blue plane and what's even
 +
 +
606
 +
00:29:56,420 --> 00:30:00,860
 +
better is many many years after this was
 +
 +
607
 +
00:29:59,660 --> 00:30:04,340
 +
almost a fait accompli
 +
 +
608
 +
00:30:00,860 --> 00:30:08,150
 +
Fred Smith's professors that I believe
 +
 +
609
 +
00:30:04,340 --> 00:30:10,040
 +
Harvard gave him a D or an F on his
 +
 +
610
 +
00:30:08,150 --> 00:30:12,350
 +
essay explaining why a company like
 +
 +
611
 +
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:15,280
 +
FedEx would be a really great idea
 +
 +
612
 +
00:30:12,350 --> 00:30:18,380
 +
fortunately he didn't listen to them and
 +
 +
613
 +
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:20,510
 +
was able to work out why this is a
 +
 +
614
 +
00:30:18,380 --> 00:30:23,630
 +
really much better way of doing many
 +
 +
615
 +
00:30:20,510 --> 00:30:25,310
 +
many forms of Transportation so we see
 +
 +
616
 +
00:30:23,630 --> 00:30:27,860
 +
this happening to us all the time in our
 +
 +
617
 +
00:30:25,310 --> 00:30:29,450
 +
technical field we start doing some
 +
 +
618
 +
00:30:27,860 --> 00:30:33,550
 +
grand thing and then three years later
 +
 +
619
 +
00:30:29,450 --> 00:30:33,550
 +
we're still working on the compiler
 +
 +
620
 +
00:30:36,820 --> 00:30:43,490
 +
we've all done it another really
 +
 +
621
 +
00:30:40,550 --> 00:30:45,380
 +
important invisible thing that we
 +
 +
622
 +
00:30:43,490 --> 00:30:50,740
 +
completely ignore is the importance of
 +
 +
623
 +
00:30:45,380 --> 00:30:55,060
 +
the ambient environment so here's a
 +
 +
624
 +
00:30:50,740 --> 00:31:05,240
 +
somewhat recognizable work area and
 +
 +
625
 +
00:30:55,060 --> 00:31:10,150
 +
cubicles do have their place it's a
 +
 +
626
 +
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:12,050
 +
certain form of efficiency here but Mike
 +
 +
627
 +
00:31:10,150 --> 00:31:14,510
 +
when I was trying to figure out what's
 +
 +
628
 +
00:31:12,050 --> 00:31:19,130
 +
what should I put in here I was thinking
 +
 +
629
 +
00:31:14,510 --> 00:31:23,120
 +
about well gee uh an alfresco bistro in
 +
 +
630
 +
00:31:19,130 --> 00:31:24,620
 +
Paris the outdoors if you buy a cup of
 +
 +
631
 +
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:29,960
 +
coffee they'll let you stay there all
 +
 +
632
 +
00:31:24,620 --> 00:31:34,850
 +
day perfect place to get stuff done but
 +
 +
633
 +
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:37,930
 +
I thought that this garden and lily pond
 +
 +
634
 +
00:31:34,850 --> 00:31:40,490
 +
that Monet built himself at Giovanni
 +
 +
635
 +
00:31:37,930 --> 00:31:42,140
 +
would be a pretty good thing we just
 +
 +
636
 +
00:31:40,490 --> 00:31:44,450
 +
don't think and that this thing does not
 +
 +
637
 +
00:31:42,140 --> 00:31:50,090
 +
cost a lot of money it's basically water
 +
 +
638
 +
00:31:44,450 --> 00:31:52,760
 +
and plants set up in a way that reminded
 +
 +
639
 +
00:31:50,090 --> 00:31:56,180
 +
him everyday of the difference between
 +
 +
640
 +
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:58,370
 +
art and problem-solving art includes
 +
 +
641
 +
00:31:56,180 --> 00:32:04,340
 +
problem solving the problem solving very
 +
 +
642
 +
00:31:58,370 --> 00:32:06,140
 +
often doesn't include art there's the
 +
 +
643
 +
00:32:04,340 --> 00:32:11,210
 +
famous error thirty-three from Xerox
 +
 +
644
 +
00:32:06,140 --> 00:32:13,280
 +
PARC that like catch-22 area 33 is
 +
 +
645
 +
00:32:11,210 --> 00:32:20,380
 +
putting somebody else's project in your
 +
 +
646
 +
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:22,700
 +
critical path could even be your friends
 +
 +
647
 +
00:32:20,380 --> 00:32:26,570
 +
many acrimonious things have happened
 +
 +
648
 +
00:32:22,700 --> 00:32:29,090
 +
from that often it's a vendor you decide
 +
 +
649
 +
00:32:26,570 --> 00:32:32,300
 +
well I'm going to do X Y & Z but I need
 +
 +
650
 +
00:32:29,090 --> 00:32:36,170
 +
son to cooperate or Microsoft to
 +
 +
651
 +
00:32:32,300 --> 00:32:37,640
 +
cooperate you could be in deep stew so
 +
 +
652
 +
00:32:36,170 --> 00:32:39,230
 +
generally speaking if you can roll your
 +
 +
653
 +
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:41,180
 +
own this is the second order thing if
 +
 +
654
 +
00:32:39,230 --> 00:32:43,160
 +
you can roll your own tools and get away
 +
 +
655
 +
00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:44,990
 +
with it you're much much better off
 +
 +
656
 +
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,770
 +
because then you have control of your
 +
 +
657
 +
00:32:44,990 --> 00:32:47,950
 +
own destiny
 +
 +
658
 +
00:32:45,770 --> 00:32:50,140
 +
then finally
 +
 +
659
 +
00:32:47,950 --> 00:32:56,400
 +
the last way of avoiding this is just
 +
 +
660
 +
00:32:50,140 --> 00:33:00,580
 +
being a reasonable adult responsible
 +
 +
661
 +
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:03,720
 +
immune to frivolous side paths non
 +
 +
662
 +
00:33:00,580 --> 00:33:09,640
 +
distractible and so forth
 +
 +
663
 +
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:15,430
 +
now of course we can reverse all of
 +
 +
664
 +
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:20,770
 +
those here's an interesting sort of last
 +
 +
665
 +
00:33:15,430 --> 00:33:22,510
 +
idea here is that people who have gotten
 +
 +
666
 +
00:33:20,770 --> 00:33:25,450
 +
through this and for one reason or
 +
 +
667
 +
00:33:22,510 --> 00:33:27,880
 +
another if they're a paradigm shifter
 +
 +
668
 +
00:33:25,450 --> 00:33:30,910
 +
type thinkers they tended to do their
 +
 +
669
 +
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:32,400
 +
work before they were thirty quick was a
 +
 +
670
 +
00:33:30,910 --> 00:33:34,780
 +
little bit older than that
 +
 +
671
 +
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:37,030
 +
Watson was quite a bit younger than that
 +
 +
672
 +
00:33:34,780 --> 00:33:41,080
 +
Newton was about twenty-six and so was
 +
 +
673
 +
00:33:37,030 --> 00:33:42,670
 +
Einstein in our field John McCarthy did
 +
 +
674
 +
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:44,860
 +
his paradigm shift when he was quite
 +
 +
675
 +
00:33:42,670 --> 00:33:47,740
 +
young and but if you're a systems person
 +
 +
676
 +
00:33:44,860 --> 00:33:49,560
 +
this is a really comforting thought for
 +
 +
677
 +
00:33:47,740 --> 00:33:52,120
 +
those of us who have gray and are here
 +
 +
678
 +
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:56,190
 +
often your best work is done later and
 +
 +
679
 +
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:58,480
 +
this is because systems have so many
 +
 +
680
 +
00:33:56,190 --> 00:34:01,300
 +
things that you have to learn about and
 +
 +
681
 +
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:03,850
 +
think about and have experience with so
 +
 +
682
 +
00:34:01,300 --> 00:34:06,010
 +
Monet himself did some of his best work
 +
 +
683
 +
00:34:03,850 --> 00:34:10,300
 +
when he was in his late 70s and 80s and
 +
 +
684
 +
00:34:06,010 --> 00:34:14,290
 +
so did Bach in his late in his late 50s
 +
 +
685
 +
00:34:10,300 --> 00:34:17,100
 +
and early 60s Bertrand Russell and our
 +
 +
686
 +
00:34:14,290 --> 00:34:19,480
 +
field our newest HP fellow David Reed
 +
 +
687
 +
00:34:17,100 --> 00:34:22,480
 +
who's one of the to his repast systems
 +
 +
688
 +
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:25,060
 +
people I know is in his 50s now and I
 +
 +
689
 +
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:27,790
 +
think thinking about systems in a deeper
 +
 +
690
 +
00:34:25,060 --> 00:34:32,470
 +
way than ever and he's been great since
 +
 +
691
 +
00:34:27,790 --> 00:34:36,070
 +
he was a in graduate school now what can
 +
 +
692
 +
00:34:32,470 --> 00:34:38,530
 +
we do it was it get older to deal with
 +
 +
693
 +
00:34:36,070 --> 00:34:40,990
 +
this and I think that there are many
 +
 +
694
 +
00:34:38,530 --> 00:34:44,190
 +
things that are possible the simplest
 +
 +
695
 +
00:34:40,990 --> 00:34:47,890
 +
and last idea I leave with you is that
 +
 +
696
 +
00:34:44,190 --> 00:34:50,080
 +
thinking of design as the center of what
 +
 +
697
 +
00:34:47,890 --> 00:34:53,500
 +
you're doing rather than science
 +
 +
698
 +
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:56,110
 +
technology engineering or math I think
 +
 +
699
 +
00:34:53,500 --> 00:35:00,010
 +
is a better metaphor because design
 +
 +
700
 +
00:34:56,110 --> 00:35:05,079
 +
involves people it involves aesthetics
 +
 +
701
 +
00:35:00,010 --> 00:35:08,619
 +
it's possible to get even adults really
 +
 +
702
 +
00:35:05,079 --> 00:35:10,180
 +
in touch with their six-year-old by
 +
 +
703
 +
00:35:08,619 --> 00:35:12,660
 +
getting them to work on a very tough
 +
 +
704
 +
00:35:10,180 --> 00:35:15,070
 +
design project that's out of their field
 +
 +
705
 +
00:35:12,660 --> 00:35:17,380
 +
and one that is serious to them this one
 +
 +
706
 +
00:35:15,070 --> 00:35:21,180
 +
is a city design project and we found
 +
 +
707
 +
00:35:17,380 --> 00:35:23,410
 +
that this works extremely well for
 +
 +
708
 +
00:35:21,180 --> 00:35:26,170
 +
children as they start building their
 +
 +
709
 +
00:35:23,410 --> 00:35:28,210
 +
pink goldfish bowl and for adults who
 +
 +
710
 +
00:35:26,170 --> 00:35:30,400
 +
have already built their pink goldfish
 +
 +
711
 +
00:35:28,210 --> 00:35:33,280
 +
bowl is to get them design a large
 +
 +
712
 +
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:36,609
 +
complex system that people have to live
 +
 +
713
 +
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:40,230
 +
in so the the difference between
 +
 +
714
 +
00:35:36,609 --> 00:35:43,630
 +
children and adults is the children are
 +
 +
715
 +
00:35:40,230 --> 00:35:46,839
 +
more open but have less knowledge to
 +
 +
716
 +
00:35:43,630 --> 00:35:48,190
 +
work with adults have more knowledge to
 +
 +
717
 +
00:35:46,839 --> 00:35:49,839
 +
work with but it's our double-edged
 +
 +
718
 +
00:35:48,190 --> 00:35:53,670
 +
sword the more knowledge we have the
 +
 +
719
 +
00:35:49,839 --> 00:35:56,890
 +
more of a tendency we have to use it so
 +
 +
720
 +
00:35:53,670 --> 00:35:58,450
 +
what I try to do and not always
 +
 +
721
 +
00:35:56,890 --> 00:36:00,550
 +
successfully as you can tell from the
 +
 +
722
 +
00:35:58,450 --> 00:36:02,410
 +
story is try and learn as much as
 +
 +
723
 +
00:36:00,550 --> 00:36:04,329
 +
possible and then try to forget it and
 +
 +
724
 +
00:36:02,410 --> 00:36:06,339
 +
only be able to smell the perfume of
 +
 +
725
 +
00:36:04,329 --> 00:36:08,109
 +
that knowledge so if you can
 +
 +
726
 +
00:36:06,339 --> 00:36:10,569
 +
successfully forget what you know except
 +
 +
727
 +
00:36:08,109 --> 00:36:12,160
 +
for the perfume then you have a chance
 +
 +
728
 +
00:36:10,569 --> 00:36:14,020
 +
of doing a little bit more of what a
 +
 +
729
 +
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:16,280
 +
six-year-old does so easily
 +
 +
730
 +
00:36:14,020 --> 00:36:22,069
 +
thank you
 +
 +
731
 +
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:22,069
 +
[Applause]
 +
 +
732
 +
00:36:26,049 --> 00:36:29,809
 +
nobody told me what I should do next but
 +
 +
733
 +
00:36:28,279 --> 00:36:31,959
 +
I think getting off the stage is a good
 +
 +
734
 +
00:36:29,809 --> 00:36:31,959
 +
idea
 +
 +
735
 +
00:36:36,090 --> 00:37:04,699
 +
[Music]

Revision as of 23:02, 5 December 2017

1 00:00:02,449 --> 00:00:06,930 ladies and gentlemen please welcome dick

2 00:00:05,069 --> 00:00:10,790 Lampman senior vice president of

3 00:00:06,930 --> 00:00:10,790 research and directors of HP labs

4 00:00:16,940 --> 00:00:23,279 earning I hope you all had a great day

5 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:27,090 yesterday for me it was pretty exciting

6 00:00:23,279 --> 00:00:29,250 to see the full power of HP's technology

7 00:00:27,090 --> 00:00:31,679 team all in one place something we

8 00:00:29,250 --> 00:00:33,270 haven't been able to do for a long time

9 00:00:31,679 --> 00:00:35,100 and as you heard yesterday something

10 00:00:33,270 --> 00:00:38,579 that we're gonna make a regular event so

11 00:00:35,100 --> 00:00:40,890 it's great day so I have the pleasure

12 00:00:38,579 --> 00:00:42,950 today of introducing Alan Kay

13 00:00:40,890 --> 00:00:46,289 you heard that very briefly yesterday

14 00:00:42,950 --> 00:00:48,410 but Alan's a difficult guy to introduce

15 00:00:46,289 --> 00:00:51,840 to be honest he's certainly well known

16 00:00:48,410 --> 00:00:54,629 for his ideas on personal computing the

17 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:57,000 intimate laptop computer the now

18 00:00:54,629 --> 00:00:58,920 ubiquitous overlapping Windows interface

19 00:00:57,000 --> 00:00:59,609 which I hope I don't see running out

20 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:02,850 there right now

21 00:00:59,609 --> 00:01:06,299 and and of course modern object-oriented

22 00:01:02,850 --> 00:01:08,159 programming as Shane master'd mentioned

23 00:01:06,299 --> 00:01:09,650 yesterday he is one of the founders it

24 00:01:08,159 --> 00:01:11,610 was one of the founders of Xerox PARC

25 00:01:09,650 --> 00:01:12,840 earlier he was a member of the

26 00:01:11,610 --> 00:01:16,920 University Utah

27 00:01:12,840 --> 00:01:20,430 ARPA team that developed the original 3d

28 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:23,189 computer graphics he has a very eclectic

29 00:01:20,430 --> 00:01:26,009 background he was the chief scientist at

30 00:01:23,189 --> 00:01:28,799 Atari a fellow at Apple Computer

31 00:01:26,009 --> 00:01:31,829 then a VP of R&D at Walt Disney Company

32 00:01:28,799 --> 00:01:33,840 and we're delighted now that he is a

33 00:01:31,829 --> 00:01:37,530 senior fellow and a member of our

34 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:39,810 technical staff at HP Labs at the same

35 00:01:37,530 --> 00:01:43,229 time he's continuing as the president

36 00:01:39,810 --> 00:01:45,899 and co-founder of viewpoint viewpoints

37 00:01:43,229 --> 00:01:48,810 Research Institute it is an institute

38 00:01:45,899 --> 00:01:51,659 that is dedicated to improving general

39 00:01:48,810 --> 00:01:54,810 education and also understanding complex

40 00:01:51,659 --> 00:01:56,790 systems and especially using new

41 00:01:54,810 --> 00:02:00,840 inventions in interactive constructive

42 00:01:56,790 --> 00:02:03,780 computing to do this Allen is and has

43 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:06,180 always been a disruptive thinker and

44 00:02:03,780 --> 00:02:08,750 today we asked him to talk about

45 00:02:06,180 --> 00:02:12,480 creativity and the title of his talk is

46 00:02:08,750 --> 00:02:13,800 the difference in creativity between

47 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:16,650 children and adults

48 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:18,120 and when I heard the title I thought to

49 00:02:16,650 --> 00:02:19,530 myself I guess at the end of the talk

50 00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:21,450 I'll have to decide which group I'd

51 00:02:19,530 --> 00:02:22,530 rather be in so I'll leave that

52 00:02:21,450 --> 00:02:25,650 challenge to you too

53 00:02:22,530 --> 00:02:35,190 anyway with that I am pleased to

54 00:02:25,650 --> 00:02:35,640 introduce Alan Kay thank you thanks very

55 00:02:35,190 --> 00:02:36,870 much

56 00:02:35,640 --> 00:02:39,870 first I'd like to say it's just an

57 00:02:36,870 --> 00:02:43,080 absolute pleasure and a privilege to be

58 00:02:39,870 --> 00:02:45,720 part of hewlett-packard I've admired the

59 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:49,500 company over the years almost came here

60 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:53,190 in the early 80s after Xerox PARC and

61 00:02:49,500 --> 00:02:56,910 I'm really glad to be here now this

62 00:02:53,190 --> 00:03:00,390 particular title and and talk came out

63 00:02:56,910 --> 00:03:03,630 of a couple of remarks I made it the HP

64 00:03:00,390 --> 00:03:07,280 Berkeley citrus meeting where I was

65 00:03:03,630 --> 00:03:11,790 describing a one of those encounters

66 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:14,370 with children that gives you a sense of

67 00:03:11,790 --> 00:03:17,310 the difference between the way adults

68 00:03:14,370 --> 00:03:20,880 and children look at the world and this

69 00:03:17,310 --> 00:03:23,610 happened in in Toronto I thought I'd

70 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:26,030 give you a little sense of what that was

71 00:03:23,610 --> 00:03:29,640 was actually like so we're up in Toronto

72 00:03:26,030 --> 00:03:34,470 it's an eighth grade classroom wonderful

73 00:03:29,640 --> 00:03:38,190 teacher and that day visiting was also a

74 00:03:34,470 --> 00:03:41,970 group of fifth graders who have been

75 00:03:38,190 --> 00:03:44,610 marked as learning disabled learning

76 00:03:41,970 --> 00:03:48,900 disabilities who had also been trying

77 00:03:44,610 --> 00:03:51,750 the sweet stuff and so the question I

78 00:03:48,900 --> 00:03:54,870 got asked by the by the eighth grade

79 00:03:51,750 --> 00:03:59,580 teacher was he said well we've been

80 00:03:54,870 --> 00:04:00,990 exploring random notion of randomness

81 00:03:59,580 --> 00:04:02,780 and stuff and one of the ways we did

82 00:04:00,990 --> 00:04:09,170 this was to make one of these little

83 00:04:02,780 --> 00:04:09,170 squeak cars kind of like this

84 00:04:13,620 --> 00:04:21,510 so make a little little object here put

85 00:04:18,730 --> 00:04:21,510 some tires on it

86 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:31,060 and when I get done I have a little

87 00:04:28,010 --> 00:04:34,580 thing that's both a graphics object and

88 00:04:31,060 --> 00:04:37,370 something that's programmable so I can

89 00:04:34,580 --> 00:04:43,120 make it a little bit smaller here I can

90 00:04:37,370 --> 00:04:45,590 call it a car I can look inside of it I

91 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:46,570 can drag out some stuff to make a little

92 00:04:45,590 --> 00:04:50,090 script here

93 00:04:46,570 --> 00:04:55,820 so if card forward by five car turn by

94 00:04:50,090 --> 00:05:00,320 five and if I just say do that over and

95 00:04:55,820 --> 00:05:02,300 over again I get a little circle these

96 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:07,690 things are sort of secretly logo turtles

97 00:05:02,300 --> 00:05:11,810 with costumes so I can put a pin down

98 00:05:07,690 --> 00:05:14,660 see the circle drawn and then the

99 00:05:11,810 --> 00:05:18,020 teacher said when we couldn't figure out

100 00:05:14,660 --> 00:05:25,190 how to do is although we could change

101 00:05:18,020 --> 00:05:30,650 the color of the of the pan so for

102 00:05:25,190 --> 00:05:38,480 instance we could click on this and we

103 00:05:30,650 --> 00:05:40,700 can make the pen trails green here there

104 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:46,010 wasn't seem to be a way of selecting

105 00:05:40,700 --> 00:05:48,350 colors using random and he had this

106 00:05:46,010 --> 00:05:50,540 notion and in fact it's true in the

107 00:05:48,350 --> 00:05:52,820 underlying language that one of the ways

108 00:05:50,540 --> 00:05:55,970 of thinking about color is a kind of a

109 00:05:52,820 --> 00:05:57,380 vector space of primaries and you should

110 00:05:55,970 --> 00:05:59,090 be able to assign random to each one of

111 00:05:57,380 --> 00:06:01,040 those and generate a lot of different

112 00:05:59,090 --> 00:06:08,090 colors and we've forgotten to put that

113 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:11,590 in the kids system so when they did the

114 00:06:08,090 --> 00:06:15,550 the random stuff they did it like this

115 00:06:11,590 --> 00:06:19,520 they would get a random number tile and

116 00:06:15,550 --> 00:06:22,400 so that's random 180 so it's turning all

117 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:23,720 over the place and this one I have

118 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:27,590 learned that I'd better turn it off

119 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:33,500 before I toss in here so I'll change

120 00:06:27,590 --> 00:06:34,900 this random 180 to random 80 and started

121 00:06:33,500 --> 00:06:36,670 going again it

122 00:06:34,900 --> 00:06:40,000 it's what they wanted to do is to do

123 00:06:36,670 --> 00:06:43,090 this but to have different colors so I

124 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:46,930 said okay here's here's one way to do it

125 00:06:43,090 --> 00:06:49,270 you can make little get little ellipses

126 00:06:46,930 --> 00:06:51,160 out and you can change their color and

127 00:06:49,270 --> 00:06:55,360 put them into a little holder and change

128 00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:59,680 the color like this let me make this a

129 00:06:55,360 --> 00:07:02,200 lighter gray here and we can put random

130 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:04,090 on the what the cursor does and then we

131 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:06,190 can pick the colors out while I was

132 00:07:04,090 --> 00:07:08,320 going through this a 10 year old from

133 00:07:06,190 --> 00:07:10,030 the learning-disabled class came up and

134 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:16,030 said oh I know a much better way to do

135 00:07:10,030 --> 00:07:20,530 this and he said look you can just pull

136 00:07:16,030 --> 00:07:24,130 a copy of that palette right out of

137 00:07:20,530 --> 00:07:28,150 there like this and you can start

138 00:07:24,130 --> 00:07:34,480 stretching it in here so if I do

139 00:07:28,150 --> 00:07:37,960 something like this he says I've got a

140 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:42,280 little thing of all the colors there and

141 00:07:37,960 --> 00:07:45,910 I can just copy this car here using the

142 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:50,410 green button and now I've got two cars

143 00:07:45,910 --> 00:07:58,330 and all I have to do is to take the

144 00:07:50,410 --> 00:07:59,830 color that's under this car color under

145 00:07:58,330 --> 00:08:04,390 this car and see if you move this car

146 00:07:59,830 --> 00:08:07,990 around that value changes and so if I

147 00:08:04,390 --> 00:08:12,180 just drop this into the script here like

148 00:08:07,990 --> 00:08:12,180 this and I make them both go

149 00:08:13,630 --> 00:08:18,000 and I looked at and I said holy shit

150 00:08:19,860 --> 00:08:25,480 it's kind of a perfect illustration of

151 00:08:22,740 --> 00:08:27,940 the teacher only wanted to do it one way

152 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:32,289 and that way wasn't available so he

153 00:08:27,940 --> 00:08:35,500 couldn't do it so I reverted back to my

154 00:08:32,289 --> 00:08:37,570 pre object data structure common-sense

155 00:08:35,500 --> 00:08:40,270 way and made a little data structure

156 00:08:37,570 --> 00:08:44,320 that doesn't do the full job whereas the

157 00:08:40,270 --> 00:08:49,420 kid just took the system directly and

158 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:52,690 the irony of the thing to me was that I

159 00:08:49,420 --> 00:08:54,580 had actually made everything in this

160 00:08:52,690 --> 00:08:57,700 system D constructible so the kid could

161 00:08:54,580 --> 00:08:59,770 take it apart but I'd forgotten because

162 00:08:57,700 --> 00:09:03,040 this this color palette that I got from

163 00:08:59,770 --> 00:09:04,510 here looked like a thing to me and I

164 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:07,960 forgot well of course it's it's just

165 00:09:04,510 --> 00:09:10,660 made out of parts here I can I can pull

166 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:13,690 out anything that I want but the kid

167 00:09:10,660 --> 00:09:16,090 just went took it as it came went with

168 00:09:13,690 --> 00:09:18,850 what it could do and immediately saw

169 00:09:16,090 --> 00:09:22,540 that the problem was actually the same

170 00:09:18,850 --> 00:09:24,550 in both things that this car was walking

171 00:09:22,540 --> 00:09:26,440 randomly around all you needed to do is

172 00:09:24,550 --> 00:09:28,240 have a copy of that car walking handling

173 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:31,720 me around over here on top of the colors

174 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:34,840 and you're done so that's the difference

175 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:37,330 between children and adults is that we

176 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:39,610 tend to think in patterns even when we

177 00:09:37,330 --> 00:09:42,760 were trying not to and the kids don't

178 00:09:39,610 --> 00:09:44,620 have that many patterns yet and so

179 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:48,400 they're much more able to deal with with

180 00:09:44,620 --> 00:09:50,560 the world that's put in front of them so

181 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:55,020 here's another example of a beautiful

182 00:09:50,560 --> 00:09:58,690 little solution completely solved by

183 00:09:55,020 --> 00:10:01,660 children these two girls the class was

184 00:09:58,690 --> 00:10:04,000 given the the challenge to figure out a

185 00:10:01,660 --> 00:10:06,190 robot car that could go down the center

186 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:09,910 of the road and so they decided to make

187 00:10:06,190 --> 00:10:12,730 a road that was blue and it had curbs

188 00:10:09,910 --> 00:10:15,250 that were yellow and green and after

189 00:10:12,730 --> 00:10:17,010 much talking amongst themselves they

190 00:10:15,250 --> 00:10:20,050 decided it was actually a very simple

191 00:10:17,010 --> 00:10:22,210 problem only make the car go forward

192 00:10:20,050 --> 00:10:24,480 when you see the middle of the road the

193 00:10:22,210 --> 00:10:26,700 sensor on the car

194 00:10:24,480 --> 00:10:29,100 turn one way when you see a curb and

195 00:10:26,700 --> 00:10:32,670 turn the other way so to them goes just

196 00:10:29,100 --> 00:10:34,440 three cases and if you notice the car

197 00:10:32,670 --> 00:10:37,380 will actually stop and turn when it

198 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:40,440 comes to a particularly sharp turn there

199 00:10:37,380 --> 00:10:41,820 and when questioned the girl said and of

200 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,829 course it will work even if we don't

201 00:10:41,820 --> 00:10:46,649 draw the road very well because the plus

202 00:10:43,829 --> 00:10:48,480 four and the minus four cancel out so

203 00:10:46,649 --> 00:10:51,000 that these things are just can run

204 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:53,100 separately and this car will always stay

205 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:57,300 on the road and will stop as soon as it

206 00:10:53,100 --> 00:10:59,880 gets off the road like there there's

207 00:10:57,300 --> 00:11:04,050 another example of the kinds of things

208 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:06,060 that children can do and in fact in many

209 00:11:04,050 --> 00:11:11,579 different ways

210 00:11:06,060 --> 00:11:15,480 six-year-olds have the most ability in

211 00:11:11,579 --> 00:11:17,940 many many different areas sometimes even

212 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:23,310 in absolute terms here's a quick example

213 00:11:17,940 --> 00:11:26,250 of first graders with a teacher who not

214 00:11:23,310 --> 00:11:27,990 only loved children but also was kind of

215 00:11:26,250 --> 00:11:30,870 an intuitive mathematician so this is

216 00:11:27,990 --> 00:11:32,279 one of the few instances ever in the

217 00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:35,160 last 30 years of working with children

218 00:11:32,279 --> 00:11:37,199 we're going to an elementary school and

219 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:40,050 find a teacher who actually has a real

220 00:11:37,199 --> 00:11:41,820 sense of mathematics this is about four

221 00:11:40,050 --> 00:11:45,120 months into their first grade she has

222 00:11:41,820 --> 00:11:49,740 them take different shaped blocks and to

223 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:52,709 make entities of the same shape each

224 00:11:49,740 --> 00:11:55,860 size larger so here's the one with

225 00:11:52,709 --> 00:11:58,170 Diamonds trapezoids are quite a

226 00:11:55,860 --> 00:12:00,959 challenge so you have to turn them

227 00:11:58,170 --> 00:12:05,630 around and then what she did was to have

228 00:12:00,959 --> 00:12:08,730 the children write down off separately

229 00:12:05,630 --> 00:12:11,130 what it is they did by making a little

230 00:12:08,730 --> 00:12:13,199 construction project out of cardboard

231 00:12:11,130 --> 00:12:16,980 and then writing down a table so this

232 00:12:13,199 --> 00:12:19,319 child Lauren said well the first one had

233 00:12:16,980 --> 00:12:21,569 one block in it and then I have to add

234 00:12:19,319 --> 00:12:23,519 three more and it had four total blocks

235 00:12:21,569 --> 00:12:25,949 and then I had to add five and it had

236 00:12:23,519 --> 00:12:28,260 nine total and I had to add seven so

237 00:12:25,949 --> 00:12:30,300 they wrote these things down and they

238 00:12:28,260 --> 00:12:34,170 could see that this one differs just by

239 00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:37,800 two here all the way along

240 00:12:34,170 --> 00:12:38,970 and then they compared them and they

241 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:41,370 discovered something really wonderful

242 00:12:38,970 --> 00:12:45,209 and that is that every single growth

243 00:12:41,370 --> 00:12:46,890 rule was exactly the same and this is a

244 00:12:45,209 --> 00:12:49,440 great crowd to show this example too

245 00:12:46,890 --> 00:12:51,930 because of surely you recognize the

246 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:54,930 second-order differential equation or if

247 00:12:51,930 --> 00:12:57,750 you're an old old computer jock like me

248 00:12:54,930 --> 00:13:00,000 it's a two-stage digital differential

249 00:12:57,750 --> 00:13:02,579 analyzer this is the kind of thing that

250 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:06,149 Babbage made the difference engine to

251 00:13:02,579 --> 00:13:09,000 compute that computes all the squares of

252 00:13:06,149 --> 00:13:12,149 the numbers driven by this constant

253 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:16,170 difference of two here also a model of

254 00:13:12,149 --> 00:13:18,450 acceleration and this is also an example

255 00:13:16,170 --> 00:13:20,540 of the kind of things that children can

256 00:13:18,450 --> 00:13:23,399 generate and the way they form

257 00:13:20,540 --> 00:13:26,760 abstractions which is not by bundling

258 00:13:23,399 --> 00:13:29,190 them up the way we do into a term but by

259 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:38,550 thinking of them as a bunch of cases

260 00:13:29,190 --> 00:13:40,529 that go together now what happens to us

261 00:13:38,550 --> 00:13:44,310 as we get older as we start forming this

262 00:13:40,529 --> 00:13:47,040 goldfish bowl made out of an invisible

263 00:13:44,310 --> 00:13:48,209 fluid that we can't see anymore so

264 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,670 McLuhan statement I don't know who

265 00:13:48,209 --> 00:13:53,730 discovered water but it wasn't a fish he

266 00:13:50,670 --> 00:13:57,630 really meant we were the fish and this

267 00:13:53,730 --> 00:14:00,029 pink fluid in here is all the things

268 00:13:57,630 --> 00:14:01,380 that we've internalized to the point

269 00:14:00,029 --> 00:14:03,600 that we can't remember that we did it

270 00:14:01,380 --> 00:14:05,399 anymore and these are these invisible

271 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:08,120 things are the things that rule our

272 00:14:05,399 --> 00:14:12,209 lives much more than almost anything and

273 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:16,170 kids learn this very early so up to

274 00:14:12,209 --> 00:14:19,170 around the age of seven children are at

275 00:14:16,170 --> 00:14:21,959 their best and after most imaginative

276 00:14:19,170 --> 00:14:23,670 with featureless blocks blocks that have

277 00:14:21,959 --> 00:14:28,730 nothing on them and you could take a

278 00:14:23,670 --> 00:14:30,959 little square block oblong block and

279 00:14:28,730 --> 00:14:32,310 suggest to the child boy this looks like

280 00:14:30,959 --> 00:14:34,740 a really wonderful truck and they'll

281 00:14:32,310 --> 00:14:38,610 play with it as a truck and then you can

282 00:14:34,740 --> 00:14:42,240 say no it also looks kind of like like a

283 00:14:38,610 --> 00:14:44,880 little baby and they'll look at it and

284 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,810 start cradling it because they're

285 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:49,540 basically their powers of imagine

286 00:14:46,810 --> 00:14:55,120 Asian are able to be projected on the

287 00:14:49,540 --> 00:14:56,560 world around them and then by around the

288 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:58,180 age of seven and actually it's going

289 00:14:56,560 --> 00:15:01,930 earlier people who've been studying this

290 00:14:58,180 --> 00:15:06,490 see a huge influence of television but

291 00:15:01,930 --> 00:15:11,080 it's also partly biological to go away

292 00:15:06,490 --> 00:15:13,690 from that kind of external imposition of

293 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:16,930 imagination which characterizes the

294 00:15:13,690 --> 00:15:19,450 young child to taking in images and

295 00:15:16,930 --> 00:15:23,740 forms from the outside and conventional

296 00:15:19,450 --> 00:15:27,310 izing them till they start wanting much

297 00:15:23,740 --> 00:15:31,240 much more detail in their toys in

298 00:15:27,310 --> 00:15:35,290 various various ways and they give you

299 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:46,120 an example of how strong this is this is

300 00:15:35,290 --> 00:15:48,790 a famous video done it NSF that went

301 00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:51,490 went to a Harvard graduation right after

302 00:15:48,790 --> 00:15:53,410 the seniors toss their tassels and ask

303 00:15:51,490 --> 00:15:55,839 them a couple of simple questions about

304 00:15:53,410 --> 00:15:57,850 the seasons and about the phases of the

305 00:15:55,839 --> 00:16:00,400 Moon so you can see what the Harvard

306 00:15:57,850 --> 00:16:02,170 graduates think about this to test how a

307 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:04,120 lifetime of Education affects our

308 00:16:02,170 --> 00:16:05,650 understanding of science we ask these

309 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:09,010 recent graduates some simple questions

310 00:16:05,650 --> 00:16:10,780 in astronomy consider for example that

311 00:16:09,010 --> 00:16:12,820 the causes of the seasons is a topic

312 00:16:10,780 --> 00:16:15,070 taught in every standard curriculum ok I

313 00:16:12,820 --> 00:16:17,410 think the seasons happens because as the

314 00:16:15,070 --> 00:16:21,040 earth travels around the Sun it gets

315 00:16:17,410 --> 00:16:22,420 nearer to the Sun which produces warmer

316 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,760 weather and gets farther away which

317 00:16:22,420 --> 00:16:26,680 produces colder weather and then hence

318 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:28,330 the seasons how hot it is or how cold it

319 00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:31,240 is in any given time of the year has to

320 00:16:28,330 --> 00:16:33,699 do with the the closeness of the earth

321 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:38,079 to the Sun during the seasonal

322 00:16:33,699 --> 00:16:39,309 the earth goes around the Sun and and it

323 00:16:38,079 --> 00:16:40,419 gets hotter when we get closer to the

324 00:16:39,309 --> 00:16:41,769 Sun and it gets colder when we get

325 00:16:40,419 --> 00:16:44,290 further away from the Sun these

326 00:16:41,769 --> 00:16:46,119 graduates like many of us think of the

327 00:16:44,290 --> 00:16:48,730 Earth's orbit as a highly exaggerated

328 00:16:46,119 --> 00:16:51,339 ellipse even though the Earth's orbit is

329 00:16:48,730 --> 00:16:53,049 very nearly circular with distance

330 00:16:51,339 --> 00:16:55,839 producing virtually no effect on the

331 00:16:53,049 --> 00:16:58,749 seasons we carry with us the strong

332 00:16:55,839 --> 00:17:01,419 incorrect belief that changing distance

333 00:16:58,749 --> 00:17:04,049 is responsible for the seasons I took

334 00:17:01,419 --> 00:17:08,980 physics and planetary motion and

335 00:17:04,049 --> 00:17:10,720 relativity I've never really had a

336 00:17:08,980 --> 00:17:12,159 scientific background whatsoever and I

337 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:13,990 and I got through school without having

338 00:17:12,159 --> 00:17:16,959 it I've gotten very far without having

339 00:17:13,990 --> 00:17:20,649 it I had quite a bit of science in high

340 00:17:16,959 --> 00:17:22,529 school yeah through physics want first

341 00:17:20,649 --> 00:17:26,169 year in two years of chemistry

342 00:17:22,529 --> 00:17:28,690 regardless of their science education 21

343 00:17:26,169 --> 00:17:30,840 of the 23 randomly selected students

344 00:17:28,690 --> 00:17:33,639 faculty and alumni of Harvard University

345 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:36,250 revealed misconceptions when asked to

346 00:17:33,639 --> 00:17:38,070 explain either the seasons or the phases

347 00:17:36,250 --> 00:17:42,240 of the Moon when it's further away from

348 00:17:38,070 --> 00:17:45,309 the Sun then it gets colder the earth

349 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:51,850 position interferes with the reflection

350 00:17:45,309 --> 00:17:53,860 of the Sun against the moon so I think

351 00:17:51,850 --> 00:17:55,990 you can see that the main curriculum at

352 00:17:53,860 --> 00:17:59,990 Harvard is confidence 101

353 00:17:55,990 --> 00:17:59,990 [Laughter]

354 00:18:00,220 --> 00:18:06,559 and if you if you know about what the

355 00:18:04,730 --> 00:18:08,390 color of the Harvard ph.d robe is you

356 00:18:06,559 --> 00:18:13,130 can see whether this Harvard professor

357 00:18:08,390 --> 00:18:15,620 got his ph.d so I kept on waiting on

358 00:18:13,130 --> 00:18:18,590 this video for NSF to ask the most

359 00:18:15,620 --> 00:18:20,809 logical next questions but they never

360 00:18:18,590 --> 00:18:22,549 did they had a different idea of what to

361 00:18:20,809 --> 00:18:26,690 do with the video so a couple of weeks

362 00:18:22,549 --> 00:18:30,730 later I and was giving a class at talk

363 00:18:26,690 --> 00:18:33,350 at UCLA and the audience were mostly

364 00:18:30,730 --> 00:18:35,029 graduating seniors and I asked a bunch

365 00:18:33,350 --> 00:18:37,070 of them to come out on the law and after

366 00:18:35,029 --> 00:18:40,010 the talk and went through exactly the

367 00:18:37,070 --> 00:18:44,299 same questions and I got roughly the

368 00:18:40,010 --> 00:18:47,059 same result about 95% of these UCLA

369 00:18:44,299 --> 00:18:48,970 graduate graduating seniors had serious

370 00:18:47,059 --> 00:18:51,860 misconceptions about one or both of

371 00:18:48,970 --> 00:18:56,779 these ideas but then I got to ask the

372 00:18:51,860 --> 00:18:58,610 obvious next question so to the ones who

373 00:18:56,779 --> 00:19:00,740 thought proximity of the earth to the

374 00:18:58,610 --> 00:19:03,500 Sun had something to do with the seasons

375 00:19:00,740 --> 00:19:04,520 I said well tell me this when it's

376 00:19:03,500 --> 00:19:06,679 summer up here in the northern

377 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:12,169 hemisphere do you know what season it is

378 00:19:06,679 --> 00:19:14,570 in the southern hemisphere and every

379 00:19:12,169 --> 00:19:19,549 single one of them did of course they

380 00:19:14,570 --> 00:19:21,380 didn't know why but what was interesting

381 00:19:19,549 --> 00:19:25,700 that there was about a thirty after they

382 00:19:21,380 --> 00:19:27,740 had said well it's winter then there's a

383 00:19:25,700 --> 00:19:29,230 30-second pause while I slowly realized

384 00:19:27,740 --> 00:19:31,610 that what they had just said

385 00:19:29,230 --> 00:19:33,679 contradicted their proximity theory and

386 00:19:31,610 --> 00:19:39,679 it's very important to realize here

387 00:19:33,679 --> 00:19:42,140 cognitively that those two ideas were

388 00:19:39,679 --> 00:19:45,289 indexed by the same terms they both had

389 00:19:42,140 --> 00:19:48,020 seasons in them and yet what happened

390 00:19:45,289 --> 00:19:50,870 was that the students could not retrieve

391 00:19:48,020 --> 00:19:53,270 anything that they knew as part of their

392 00:19:50,870 --> 00:19:56,000 thinking process so they just fell back

393 00:19:53,270 --> 00:19:57,289 on their common sense and it's warmer

394 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,659 when you're nearer the stove and so

395 00:19:57,289 --> 00:20:01,340 forth and for the students who are like

396 00:19:59,659 --> 00:20:03,380 this guy who thought that the earth had

397 00:20:01,340 --> 00:20:05,470 something to do with the phases of the

398 00:20:03,380 --> 00:20:07,789 Moon I asked them have you ever seen the

399 00:20:05,470 --> 00:20:10,880 Sun and the moon in the sky at the same

400 00:20:07,789 --> 00:20:11,410 time and they all had and I said well is

401 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,350 the

402 00:20:11,410 --> 00:20:16,870 moon sometimes in phase and yeah it's

403 00:20:14,350 --> 00:20:19,059 often in phase unless they're the

404 00:20:16,870 --> 00:20:20,980 opposite ends of the horizon the moon is

405 00:20:19,059 --> 00:20:22,929 always in phase and then again a

406 00:20:20,980 --> 00:20:25,390 30-second pause while I realize there is

407 00:20:22,929 --> 00:20:26,830 no pseudopod sticking out from the earth

408 00:20:25,390 --> 00:20:29,290 you know they could see both of them up

409 00:20:26,830 --> 00:20:31,900 there so this is something they'd seen

410 00:20:29,290 --> 00:20:33,640 dozens and dozens of times but it was

411 00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:35,230 again stored in another little

412 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:38,020 compartment that you could illicit it

413 00:20:35,230 --> 00:20:41,350 through questioning but it wasn't part

414 00:20:38,020 --> 00:20:45,030 of their thinking process so this what

415 00:20:41,350 --> 00:20:48,850 we're seeing here is actually a normal

416 00:20:45,030 --> 00:20:50,890 completely normal kind of behavior and

417 00:20:48,850 --> 00:20:52,330 it's funny because technical and

418 00:20:50,890 --> 00:20:53,530 scientific people always laugh when they

419 00:20:52,330 --> 00:20:55,240 see the students doing that but what

420 00:20:53,530 --> 00:20:57,240 they don't realize is that they do it

421 00:20:55,240 --> 00:21:00,520 themselves in a different area

422 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:02,650 because this is one of the key notes the

423 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:08,530 keys to think thinking about human

424 00:21:02,650 --> 00:21:10,600 thinking Mircea Eliade is basically a

425 00:21:08,530 --> 00:21:12,549 mat an anthropologist who's interested

426 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:15,720 in belief systems it's written many

427 00:21:12,549 --> 00:21:18,820 interesting books as a particularly

428 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:22,419 interesting anecdote in this book called

429 00:21:18,820 --> 00:21:25,200 the myth of the eternal return and this

430 00:21:22,419 --> 00:21:27,460 was in the 30s he and a bunch of other

431 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,890 anthropologists were going through

432 00:21:27,460 --> 00:21:34,780 Eastern Europe writing down and

433 00:21:29,890 --> 00:21:36,490 recording folk songs and stories and so

434 00:21:34,780 --> 00:21:39,070 forth and they came to a village that

435 00:21:36,490 --> 00:21:42,790 had a particularly beautiful song about

436 00:21:39,070 --> 00:21:44,290 a young bride and a handsome groom who

437 00:21:42,790 --> 00:21:47,770 are on their way to their wedding and

438 00:21:44,290 --> 00:21:51,429 the fairies swooped down jealously and

439 00:21:47,770 --> 00:21:54,640 took the groom away and the wedding

440 00:21:51,429 --> 00:21:56,140 never happened and it was such a

441 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,200 beautiful song that they questioned the

442 00:21:56,140 --> 00:22:01,690 villagers more about it and they said

443 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:04,360 well how long ago did it happen Oh a

444 00:22:01,690 --> 00:22:08,830 long time ago well how long it going

445 00:22:04,360 --> 00:22:10,299 they said Oh about 50 years ago and they

446 00:22:08,830 --> 00:22:15,130 questioned them more and discovered that

447 00:22:10,299 --> 00:22:17,590 the bride-to-be was still living so they

448 00:22:15,130 --> 00:22:22,450 went to talk to her she said no no that

449 00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:24,700 song we were walking along the side of a

450 00:22:22,450 --> 00:22:26,080 hill and he tripped on a root

451 00:22:24,700 --> 00:22:29,200 fell down the hill and broke his neck

452 00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:31,800 and you know it was very sad but that's

453 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:33,880 what happened so they went back to the

454 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:36,190 villagers and said well she said he

455 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:41,850 tripped on a root and they said no no

456 00:22:36,190 --> 00:22:45,040 the fairies came down and so basically

457 00:22:41,850 --> 00:22:47,260 almost everything we know and think

458 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:51,010 about even when we're trying to do

459 00:22:47,260 --> 00:22:52,720 better are in the form of stories the

460 00:22:51,010 --> 00:22:55,210 stories are usually better than what

461 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:58,960 happened in the sense of their tidiness

462 00:22:55,210 --> 00:23:00,760 the stories are hermetic so if you see a

463 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:03,310 movie that you like last week that's

464 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:05,440 very very different and even

465 00:23:03,310 --> 00:23:07,570 contradictory to the movie you saw today

466 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:09,490 and liked there's no feeling of

467 00:23:07,570 --> 00:23:11,650 dissonance at all because it's the

468 00:23:09,490 --> 00:23:16,300 purpose of these stories to be

469 00:23:11,650 --> 00:23:19,840 compartmentalized and hole in themselves

470 00:23:16,300 --> 00:23:24,780 and so we have this compartmentalization

471 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:28,570 system that is also very very case based

472 00:23:24,780 --> 00:23:31,360 so nothing resembling what we would call

473 00:23:28,570 --> 00:23:35,080 modern thinking is actually built into

474 00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:39,040 our nervous systems so one way of

475 00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:40,780 thinking about this stuff is if we take

476 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:43,330 the pink stuff in the goldfish bowl and

477 00:23:40,780 --> 00:23:44,920 flatten it out we have Arthur kessler's

478 00:23:43,330 --> 00:23:48,460 model of thinking which is kind of an

479 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:50,140 ant crawling along a plane and again

480 00:23:48,460 --> 00:23:52,750 it's blissfully unaware that the plane

481 00:23:50,140 --> 00:23:56,620 is pink and the ant can have the

482 00:23:52,750 --> 00:23:58,780 illusion of progress so I can point

483 00:23:56,620 --> 00:24:02,350 itself at a goal and try to get to it

484 00:23:58,780 --> 00:24:03,970 and it can problem solve and get around

485 00:24:02,350 --> 00:24:10,180 the goal but everything that's doing is

486 00:24:03,970 --> 00:24:13,240 is actually pink but if you ant like us

487 00:24:10,180 --> 00:24:16,000 maybe taking a shower out for a run

488 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:17,680 getting up in the morning a little

489 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:22,080 unguarded thing a little blue thought

490 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:22,080 might poke up but

491 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:30,860 we've spent years with our parents

492 00:24:26,020 --> 00:24:35,750 school our culture going to church of

493 00:24:30,860 --> 00:24:37,970 various kinds learning the pink and it's

494 00:24:35,750 --> 00:24:40,580 good reason for it this is one of these

495 00:24:37,970 --> 00:24:42,140 cases where the first order theory is a

496 00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:43,700 good one and it's opposite from the

497 00:24:42,140 --> 00:24:44,030 second order theory which is also a good

498 00:24:43,700 --> 00:24:45,590 one

499 00:24:44,030 --> 00:24:49,010 first order theory is if you're a

500 00:24:45,590 --> 00:24:51,890 subsistence Society don't try to make

501 00:24:49,010 --> 00:24:56,060 too many experiments you can't afford to

502 00:24:51,890 --> 00:24:58,640 lose and so our basic approach to things

503 00:24:56,060 --> 00:25:03,800 is to be relatively conservative and to

504 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:05,980 improve slowly on the fringes but every

505 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:10,220 once in a while in spite of all of this

506 00:25:05,980 --> 00:25:13,150 you get a full-fledged blue idea it's an

507 00:25:10,220 --> 00:25:15,590 outlaw idea it's outside the confines of

508 00:25:13,150 --> 00:25:17,300 common sense and so how many people here

509 00:25:15,590 --> 00:25:21,740 have had one of those ideas betcha

510 00:25:17,300 --> 00:25:23,300 everybody has had a weird idea now the

511 00:25:21,740 --> 00:25:25,490 problem with these weird ideas like all

512 00:25:23,300 --> 00:25:31,550 ideas is almost all of them are mediocre

513 00:25:25,490 --> 00:25:33,200 down to bad even the blue ones now often

514 00:25:31,550 --> 00:25:36,820 when people had a blue idea in the past

515 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,820 they'd go out and start a religion

516 00:25:37,870 --> 00:25:41,720 because if you've had one of these blue

517 00:25:40,010 --> 00:25:44,570 ideas you know it seems to come from the

518 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:46,130 heavens you weren't really thinking

519 00:25:44,570 --> 00:25:49,520 about this and all of a sudden you have

520 00:25:46,130 --> 00:25:50,990 this weird thought so one of the most

521 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,330 important things that Benny Landa

522 00:25:50,990 --> 00:25:54,800 pointed out yesterday is you have to be

523 00:25:53,330 --> 00:25:56,770 very careful with these blue ideas

524 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,820 because they seem to be manifestly true

525 00:25:56,770 --> 00:26:01,310 and you have to make sure that the blue

526 00:25:58,820 --> 00:26:05,300 ideas above some special kind of

527 00:26:01,310 --> 00:26:07,760 threshold before because it's going to

528 00:26:05,300 --> 00:26:09,050 take a lot of work to first work it out

529 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:11,450 it's going to take a lot more work to

530 00:26:09,050 --> 00:26:18,740 convince anybody that's a reasonable

531 00:26:11,450 --> 00:26:20,870 idea and this is because for the really

532 00:26:18,740 --> 00:26:25,240 unusual ideas it takes almost as much

533 00:26:20,870 --> 00:26:28,550 creative effort to understand and learn

534 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:30,500 as it did to originally invent it and

535 00:26:28,550 --> 00:26:33,230 this is what what is tough because when

536 00:26:30,500 --> 00:26:37,400 we have one of these ideas we work it

537 00:26:33,230 --> 00:26:41,060 out and it works out beautifully at some

538 00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:42,620 point we forget what happened before we

539 00:26:41,060 --> 00:26:44,390 have that idea what we were like because

540 00:26:42,620 --> 00:26:47,930 we're now a new kind of person because

541 00:26:44,390 --> 00:26:50,870 of this idea and we cannot believe that

542 00:26:47,930 --> 00:26:52,880 other people can't understand it because

543 00:26:50,870 --> 00:26:58,810 it's so manifestly true and here's the

544 00:26:52,880 --> 00:27:02,570 demo so how do we get in the way of this

545 00:26:58,810 --> 00:27:04,540 as I talked about two things already

546 00:27:02,570 --> 00:27:07,490 case based reasoning and

547 00:27:04,540 --> 00:27:10,460 compartmentalization and the third one

548 00:27:07,490 --> 00:27:12,920 which is very related to this is called

549 00:27:10,460 --> 00:27:15,650 instrumental reasoning built into all

550 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:17,390 human nervous systems is the tendency to

551 00:27:15,650 --> 00:27:21,920 get really interested in our current

552 00:27:17,390 --> 00:27:24,680 goals and to judge new ideas and new

553 00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:29,990 tools solely by their ability to deal

554 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:31,580 with our current goals so there's a few

555 00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:34,940 percentage of people who are much better

556 00:27:31,580 --> 00:27:37,940 at transforming themselves in the

557 00:27:34,940 --> 00:27:39,920 presence of a new idea in the presence

558 00:27:37,940 --> 00:27:42,170 of a new tool they change themselves

559 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:44,960 they don't try and change the idea and

560 00:27:42,170 --> 00:27:47,090 the tool into them but this is very rare

561 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:50,090 and so one way of thinking about this is

562 00:27:47,090 --> 00:27:53,600 that instrumental reasoning prevents

563 00:27:50,090 --> 00:27:55,580 this little blue hop over the fence of

564 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:58,610 your goal structure even to a new pink

565 00:27:55,580 --> 00:28:01,010 idea something that's part of the

566 00:27:58,610 --> 00:28:03,680 conventional way of doing things but we

567 00:28:01,010 --> 00:28:06,800 can't get to it because we're focused on

568 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:09,500 this and this accounts in many many

569 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:11,420 parts for why the last the

570 00:28:09,500 --> 00:28:15,650 commercialization of the PC has been so

571 00:28:11,420 --> 00:28:18,850 boring exceptions are interesting but

572 00:28:15,650 --> 00:28:21,380 generally speaking most business people

573 00:28:18,850 --> 00:28:25,220 are very goal-oriented they're very

574 00:28:21,380 --> 00:28:28,700 instrumental they look at new ideas and

575 00:28:25,220 --> 00:28:29,570 new technology as and judge it as to

576 00:28:28,700 --> 00:28:30,740 whether it is

577 00:28:29,570 --> 00:28:33,200 similar to what they're doing but a

578 00:28:30,740 --> 00:28:36,950 little bit better and the people who

579 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:40,160 have had a exquisite rhythm we're just

580 00:28:36,950 --> 00:28:42,800 staying a couple of epsilon ahead of the

581 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:45,050 slow pace of business learning have been

582 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:47,810 tremendously successful people like

583 00:28:45,050 --> 00:28:51,800 Engelbart who actually understood in one

584 00:28:47,810 --> 00:28:53,390 fell swoop in the 60s one large part of

585 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,310 what computers were really good for and

586 00:28:53,390 --> 00:28:57,410 how they should be used by people who

587 00:28:55,310 --> 00:29:00,680 are working have not to this day been

588 00:28:57,410 --> 00:29:03,320 understood or adopted so that's a little

589 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:08,350 discouraging and in fact there's a few

590 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:08,350 more discouraging things to add here

591 00:29:08,980 --> 00:29:15,620 another one that we will recognize in

592 00:29:11,930 --> 00:29:17,240 our own technical lives as well as

593 00:29:15,620 --> 00:29:21,440 elsewhere as when the sub goals become

594 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:23,510 the goals so you usually start off doing

595 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,760 something that has a grand purpose and

596 00:29:23,510 --> 00:29:27,800 after two or three years of solving sub

597 00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:32,990 goals you can't remember what the grand

598 00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:38,330 purpose is anymore so originally trains

599 00:29:32,990 --> 00:29:41,570 railroads were set up to deal with Trant

600 00:29:38,330 --> 00:29:45,230 transportation but by the 30s the

601 00:29:41,570 --> 00:29:47,030 railroad companies only invested in

602 00:29:45,230 --> 00:29:51,350 improving railroads and they completely

603 00:29:47,030 --> 00:29:53,180 missed the idea of the other dimension

604 00:29:51,350 --> 00:29:56,420 this is code of a perfect analog to the

605 00:29:53,180 --> 00:29:59,660 pink plane blue plane and what's even

606 00:29:56,420 --> 00:30:00,860 better is many many years after this was

607 00:29:59,660 --> 00:30:04,340 almost a fait accompli

608 00:30:00,860 --> 00:30:08,150 Fred Smith's professors that I believe

609 00:30:04,340 --> 00:30:10,040 Harvard gave him a D or an F on his

610 00:30:08,150 --> 00:30:12,350 essay explaining why a company like

611 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:15,280 FedEx would be a really great idea

612 00:30:12,350 --> 00:30:18,380 fortunately he didn't listen to them and

613 00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:20,510 was able to work out why this is a

614 00:30:18,380 --> 00:30:23,630 really much better way of doing many

615 00:30:20,510 --> 00:30:25,310 many forms of Transportation so we see

616 00:30:23,630 --> 00:30:27,860 this happening to us all the time in our

617 00:30:25,310 --> 00:30:29,450 technical field we start doing some

618 00:30:27,860 --> 00:30:33,550 grand thing and then three years later

619 00:30:29,450 --> 00:30:33,550 we're still working on the compiler

620 00:30:36,820 --> 00:30:43,490 we've all done it another really

621 00:30:40,550 --> 00:30:45,380 important invisible thing that we

622 00:30:43,490 --> 00:30:50,740 completely ignore is the importance of

623 00:30:45,380 --> 00:30:55,060 the ambient environment so here's a

624 00:30:50,740 --> 00:31:05,240 somewhat recognizable work area and

625 00:30:55,060 --> 00:31:10,150 cubicles do have their place it's a

626 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:12,050 certain form of efficiency here but Mike

627 00:31:10,150 --> 00:31:14,510 when I was trying to figure out what's

628 00:31:12,050 --> 00:31:19,130 what should I put in here I was thinking

629 00:31:14,510 --> 00:31:23,120 about well gee uh an alfresco bistro in

630 00:31:19,130 --> 00:31:24,620 Paris the outdoors if you buy a cup of

631 00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:29,960 coffee they'll let you stay there all

632 00:31:24,620 --> 00:31:34,850 day perfect place to get stuff done but

633 00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:37,930 I thought that this garden and lily pond

634 00:31:34,850 --> 00:31:40,490 that Monet built himself at Giovanni

635 00:31:37,930 --> 00:31:42,140 would be a pretty good thing we just

636 00:31:40,490 --> 00:31:44,450 don't think and that this thing does not

637 00:31:42,140 --> 00:31:50,090 cost a lot of money it's basically water

638 00:31:44,450 --> 00:31:52,760 and plants set up in a way that reminded

639 00:31:50,090 --> 00:31:56,180 him everyday of the difference between

640 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:58,370 art and problem-solving art includes

641 00:31:56,180 --> 00:32:04,340 problem solving the problem solving very

642 00:31:58,370 --> 00:32:06,140 often doesn't include art there's the

643 00:32:04,340 --> 00:32:11,210 famous error thirty-three from Xerox

644 00:32:06,140 --> 00:32:13,280 PARC that like catch-22 area 33 is

645 00:32:11,210 --> 00:32:20,380 putting somebody else's project in your

646 00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:22,700 critical path could even be your friends

647 00:32:20,380 --> 00:32:26,570 many acrimonious things have happened

648 00:32:22,700 --> 00:32:29,090 from that often it's a vendor you decide

649 00:32:26,570 --> 00:32:32,300 well I'm going to do X Y & Z but I need

650 00:32:29,090 --> 00:32:36,170 son to cooperate or Microsoft to

651 00:32:32,300 --> 00:32:37,640 cooperate you could be in deep stew so

652 00:32:36,170 --> 00:32:39,230 generally speaking if you can roll your

653 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:41,180 own this is the second order thing if

654 00:32:39,230 --> 00:32:43,160 you can roll your own tools and get away

655 00:32:41,180 --> 00:32:44,990 with it you're much much better off

656 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,770 because then you have control of your

657 00:32:44,990 --> 00:32:47,950 own destiny

658 00:32:45,770 --> 00:32:50,140 then finally

659 00:32:47,950 --> 00:32:56,400 the last way of avoiding this is just

660 00:32:50,140 --> 00:33:00,580 being a reasonable adult responsible

661 00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:03,720 immune to frivolous side paths non

662 00:33:00,580 --> 00:33:09,640 distractible and so forth

663 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:15,430 now of course we can reverse all of

664 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:20,770 those here's an interesting sort of last

665 00:33:15,430 --> 00:33:22,510 idea here is that people who have gotten

666 00:33:20,770 --> 00:33:25,450 through this and for one reason or

667 00:33:22,510 --> 00:33:27,880 another if they're a paradigm shifter

668 00:33:25,450 --> 00:33:30,910 type thinkers they tended to do their

669 00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:32,400 work before they were thirty quick was a

670 00:33:30,910 --> 00:33:34,780 little bit older than that

671 00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:37,030 Watson was quite a bit younger than that

672 00:33:34,780 --> 00:33:41,080 Newton was about twenty-six and so was

673 00:33:37,030 --> 00:33:42,670 Einstein in our field John McCarthy did

674 00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:44,860 his paradigm shift when he was quite

675 00:33:42,670 --> 00:33:47,740 young and but if you're a systems person

676 00:33:44,860 --> 00:33:49,560 this is a really comforting thought for

677 00:33:47,740 --> 00:33:52,120 those of us who have gray and are here

678 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:56,190 often your best work is done later and

679 00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:58,480 this is because systems have so many

680 00:33:56,190 --> 00:34:01,300 things that you have to learn about and

681 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:03,850 think about and have experience with so

682 00:34:01,300 --> 00:34:06,010 Monet himself did some of his best work

683 00:34:03,850 --> 00:34:10,300 when he was in his late 70s and 80s and

684 00:34:06,010 --> 00:34:14,290 so did Bach in his late in his late 50s

685 00:34:10,300 --> 00:34:17,100 and early 60s Bertrand Russell and our

686 00:34:14,290 --> 00:34:19,480 field our newest HP fellow David Reed

687 00:34:17,100 --> 00:34:22,480 who's one of the to his repast systems

688 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:25,060 people I know is in his 50s now and I

689 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:27,790 think thinking about systems in a deeper

690 00:34:25,060 --> 00:34:32,470 way than ever and he's been great since

691 00:34:27,790 --> 00:34:36,070 he was a in graduate school now what can

692 00:34:32,470 --> 00:34:38,530 we do it was it get older to deal with

693 00:34:36,070 --> 00:34:40,990 this and I think that there are many

694 00:34:38,530 --> 00:34:44,190 things that are possible the simplest

695 00:34:40,990 --> 00:34:47,890 and last idea I leave with you is that

696 00:34:44,190 --> 00:34:50,080 thinking of design as the center of what

697 00:34:47,890 --> 00:34:53,500 you're doing rather than science

698 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:56,110 technology engineering or math I think

699 00:34:53,500 --> 00:35:00,010 is a better metaphor because design

700 00:34:56,110 --> 00:35:05,079 involves people it involves aesthetics

701 00:35:00,010 --> 00:35:08,619 it's possible to get even adults really

702 00:35:05,079 --> 00:35:10,180 in touch with their six-year-old by

703 00:35:08,619 --> 00:35:12,660 getting them to work on a very tough

704 00:35:10,180 --> 00:35:15,070 design project that's out of their field

705 00:35:12,660 --> 00:35:17,380 and one that is serious to them this one

706 00:35:15,070 --> 00:35:21,180 is a city design project and we found

707 00:35:17,380 --> 00:35:23,410 that this works extremely well for

708 00:35:21,180 --> 00:35:26,170 children as they start building their

709 00:35:23,410 --> 00:35:28,210 pink goldfish bowl and for adults who

710 00:35:26,170 --> 00:35:30,400 have already built their pink goldfish

711 00:35:28,210 --> 00:35:33,280 bowl is to get them design a large

712 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:36,609 complex system that people have to live

713 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:40,230 in so the the difference between

714 00:35:36,609 --> 00:35:43,630 children and adults is the children are

715 00:35:40,230 --> 00:35:46,839 more open but have less knowledge to

716 00:35:43,630 --> 00:35:48,190 work with adults have more knowledge to

717 00:35:46,839 --> 00:35:49,839 work with but it's our double-edged

718 00:35:48,190 --> 00:35:53,670 sword the more knowledge we have the

719 00:35:49,839 --> 00:35:56,890 more of a tendency we have to use it so

720 00:35:53,670 --> 00:35:58,450 what I try to do and not always

721 00:35:56,890 --> 00:36:00,550 successfully as you can tell from the

722 00:35:58,450 --> 00:36:02,410 story is try and learn as much as

723 00:36:00,550 --> 00:36:04,329 possible and then try to forget it and

724 00:36:02,410 --> 00:36:06,339 only be able to smell the perfume of

725 00:36:04,329 --> 00:36:08,109 that knowledge so if you can

726 00:36:06,339 --> 00:36:10,569 successfully forget what you know except

727 00:36:08,109 --> 00:36:12,160 for the perfume then you have a chance

728 00:36:10,569 --> 00:36:14,020 of doing a little bit more of what a

729 00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:16,280 six-year-old does so easily

730 00:36:14,020 --> 00:36:22,069 thank you

731 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:22,069 [Applause]

732 00:36:26,049 --> 00:36:29,809 nobody told me what I should do next but

733 00:36:28,279 --> 00:36:31,959 I think getting off the stage is a good

734 00:36:29,809 --> 00:36:31,959 idea

735 00:36:36,090 --> 00:37:04,699 [Music]